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Thread: Netflix - Making a Murderer

  1. #151

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    Quote Originally Posted by A-Smith View Post
    I think they did it. Avery was an open and shut case. I have moderated a bit and am torn as to whether there was enough to convict Dassey. I believe his confession though after reading the transcript.
    Open and shut? Are you a cop?
    Balls deeep... "I pretty much love all of the fast and furious movies."

  2. #152

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    Quote Originally Posted by volfanjo View Post

    What we can critique the documentary for, if anything, is its cryptic treatment of Bobby Dassey, the boyfriend, and the ex-boyfriend. Boy they sure look guilty, right? Well maybe they are. Maybe one of them is, or two of them. But the troubling thing about advocacy journalism is that it does the EXACT same thing it critiques the prosecution for: vague accusations, ignoring evidence, "planting" ideas in the viewers' head. This happened on Serial and now is happening to many in the Avery case. We still don't know how Ms. Halbach was killed and where she was killed, but a bunch of people on the internet are darn sure this ex-boyfriend did it! Should we hold SA's and police to higher standard than internet posters? Absolutely. But what about documentarians? What is the standard for them?

    .
    These documentarians didn't do any of what you claimed. You just made this up.
    Balls deeep... "I pretty much love all of the fast and furious movies."

  3. #153

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tenacious D View Post
    J.

    All of the bleeding heart / stupid / meaningless other shit that some of you think trumps the fact that they actually committed the crimes being put well-aside, justice was done.

    Come at me, you bunch of pot-loving, class / race-baiting dipshits.
    The fact that?
    Balls deeep... "I pretty much love all of the fast and furious movies."

  4. #154

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tenacious D View Post
    I could not have opposed a mistrial. But the state was going to prosecute that one until they got him, for sure.

    You know, I just thought about something - no, i'm not changing my mind - while there was no EDTA found in Avery's bloodstains....after that, the documentary went silent as to what then did happen with that blood? It wasn't used to plant his blood - but what was it used for, who accessed it, why, etc.?

    And, for the life of me, I can't figure out how he killed her. Were it not for the bullet in the garage, I'd say that he put her in the fire pit and shot her there, hence, no blood or DNA anywhere else. I wonder if the police just found a bullet, put her DNA on it, and claimed to have found it in the garage so as to explain how it was preserved.
    You mean the CLEARLY invalid EDTA test?
    Balls deeep... "I pretty much love all of the fast and furious movies."

  5. #155

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    Quote Originally Posted by IP View Post
    If he did it, he likely did it outside at/near the place of burning. I think the bullet was either completely or partially fabricated by the police to get the conviction.

    I do not believe her throat was slashed, as I don't believe Brendan actually knows anything. There is no physical evidence of any of the crap he stated regarding a knife.
    I agree with this 100%
    Balls deeep... "I pretty much love all of the fast and furious movies."

  6. #156

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    Quote Originally Posted by A-Smith View Post
    This is why Casey Anthony walked. Pieces of evidence shouldn't be viewed independently. Say you are only 50% a piece of evidence points to a person's guilt. But then line up 10 pieces of evidence that you are similarly only 50% sure proves that they're guilty. The defendant has less than a 1/1000 chance of being innocent in such a case. That's not a reasonable doubt. In this case you've got at least 10 pieces of evidence that point to Steven Avery's guilt. Some of these pieces are way better than 50%. Steven's blood (preservative free) was in her RAV-4. To me that alone is enough. Throw every single other piece out. Dude had motive (he asked for the girl by name and called her using *67), opportunity (last person to claim to see her alive), and DNA evidence.
    How in the hell does Steven Avery's blood get in that spot?
    Balls deeep... "I pretty much love all of the fast and furious movies."

  7. #157

  8. #158

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    Quote Originally Posted by kidbourbon View Post
    Open and shut? Are you a cop?
    he had torture devices similar to what Dassey described, he asked for the girl, he *67ed the girl, DNA evidence all around, bleach stained clothes for cleaning up the mess, remains found on the property. Seems like there was more stuff but can't remember. Pretty easy stuff for a jury to make a verdict on. Documentary was a complete defense attorney propaganda piece.

  9. #159

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    Phone call with mom:
    Mom: What all happened, what are you talking about?
    Brendan: About what Me & Steven did that day,
    Mom: What about it?
    Brendan: Well, Mike & Mark & Matt came up one day and took another interview with me and said because they think I was lying but so, they said if I come out with it that I would have to go to jail for 90 years.
    Mom: What?
    Brendan: Ya. But if came out with itT would probably get I dunno about like 20 or less. After the interview they told me if I wanted to say something to her family and said that I was sorry for what I did.
    Mom: Then Steven did do it.
    Brendan: Ya
    Mom: (Mom Crying) Why diddn't you tell me about this?
    Brendan. Ya, but they came out wi.th something that was untrue with me
    Mom:. What's that?
    Brendan: They said that I sold crack
    Mom: So did you talk to her family?
    Brendan: No
    M: Huh
    Brendan: They just asked me if I wanted to say something to them, on the tape.
    Mom: Did you?
    Brendan: .lust that I was sorry for what I did.
    ...
    Mom: Did he make you do this?
    Brendan: Ya.
    Mom: Then why didn't you tell him that.
    Brendan: Tell him what
    Mom: That Steven made you do it. You know he made you do a lot of things.
    Brendan: Ya, I told them that. I even told them about Steven touching me and that.
    Mom: What do you mean touching you?
    Brendan: He would grab me somewhere where I was uncomfortable.
    Mom: Brendan I am your mother.
    Brendan. Ya.
    Mom: Why didn't you come to me? Why didn't you tell me? Was this all before this happened?
    Brendan: What do you mean?
    Mom: All before this happened, did he touch you before all this stuff happened to you.
    Brendan: Ya.
    Mom: Why didn't you come to me, because then he would have been gone then and this wouldn't have happened.
    Brendan: Ya ..
    Mom: Yes, and you would still be here with me.
    Brendan: Yes, Well you know I did it.
    Mom: Huh
    Brendan. You know he always touched us and that.
    Mom: I didn't think there. He used to horse around with you guys.
    Brendan: Ya, but you remember he would always do stuff to Brian and that.
    Mom: What do you mean.
    Brendan: Well he would like fake pumping him
    Mom: Goofing around
    Brendan: Ya but, like that one time when he was going with what's her name Jessica .. sister. Mom: Teresa?
    Brendan: Ya. That one day when she was over, Steven and Blaine and Brian and I was downstairs and Steven was touching her and that.
    .

  10. #160

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    Quote Originally Posted by A-Smith View Post
    he had torture devices similar to what Dassey described, he asked for the girl, he *67ed the girl, DNA evidence all around, bleach stained clothes for cleaning up the mess, remains found on the property. Seems like there was more stuff but can't remember. Pretty easy stuff for a jury to make a verdict on. Documentary was a complete defense attorney propaganda piece.
    Do tell.
    Balls deeep... "I pretty much love all of the fast and furious movies."

  11. #161

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    And are you a cop?
    Balls deeep... "I pretty much love all of the fast and furious movies."

  12. #162

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    Quote Originally Posted by kidbourbon View Post
    Do tell.
    Didn't they find his sweat and non edta blood in her vehicle? The bullet with Halbach's DNA on it came from Avery's gun as well.

    No. Not a cop, and I tend to be anti-authoritarian. I thought the original question was KB rhetorical stuff. I just think the bad guys are in jail despite the procedural issues.

  13. #163

  14. #164
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    Some of you seem to think the blood was definitely EDTA/preservative free. It wasn't. That was a lie. The test doesn't work that way, and that the FBI guy was allowed to say that in front of a jury is a huge mistake by the court. It isn't ****ing true. The test can sometimes detect EDTA, it can not, ever, eliminate the possibility of there being EDTA. That's a huge distinction. The amount of time that had passed after the sample drying made it unlikely EDTA would be found even in a sample from an EDTA tube.

    So tired of hearing people say "EDTA-free" or "it didn't come from the tube." No such test exists on this Earth to determine such things.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tmac61 View Post
    I tried. I will continue to embarrass you in front of your friends.

  15. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by A-Smith View Post
    he had torture devices similar to what Dassey described, he asked for the girl, he *67ed the girl, DNA evidence all around, bleach stained clothes for cleaning up the mess, remains found on the property. Seems like there was more stuff but can't remember. Pretty easy stuff for a jury to make a verdict on. Documentary was a complete defense attorney propaganda piece.
    Dassey could have seen those things before. He lives next door. That doesn't help or hurt the case any more than him knowing what his bedroom looked like.

    Being a creeper doesn't prove anything. He had creeped her before and not killed her.

    DNA evidence was not "all around." It was impossibly absent from some places and ridiculously present in others.

    The remains were pretty clearly moved in some way. You're not fairly presenting the facts.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tmac61 View Post
    I tried. I will continue to embarrass you in front of your friends.

  16. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by A-Smith View Post
    Didn't they find his sweat and non edta blood in her vehicle? The bullet with Halbach's DNA on it came from Avery's gun as well.

    No. Not a cop, and I tend to be anti-authoritarian. I thought the original question was KB rhetorical stuff. I just think the bad guys are in jail despite the procedural issues.
    You mean the gun that they had access to for 4 to 5 days, and wasn't found until months and months later? In a garage with deer blood everywhere but not a trace of Halbach's? Do you think he's a magician?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tmac61 View Post
    I tried. I will continue to embarrass you in front of your friends.

  17. #167

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    .
    Last edited by A-Smith; 03-08-2016 at 03:31 PM.

  18. #168

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    Quote Originally Posted by IP View Post
    Some of you seem to think the blood was definitely EDTA/preservative free. It wasn't. That was a lie. The test doesn't work that way, and that the FBI guy was allowed to say that in front of a jury is a huge mistake by the court. It isn't ****ing true. The test can sometimes detect EDTA, it can not, ever, eliminate the possibility of there being EDTA. That's a huge distinction. The amount of time that had passed after the sample drying made it unlikely EDTA would be found even in a sample from an EDTA tube.

    So tired of hearing people say "EDTA-free" or "it didn't come from the tube." No such test exists on this Earth to determine such things.
    What's the false negative rate for EDTA presence?

  19. #169

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    One thing that struck me, that I had forgotten about, was the "coincidence" of having a bonfire on the night she was killed.

  20. #170

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    Quote Originally Posted by IP View Post
    Dassey could have seen those things before. He lives next door. That doesn't help or hurt the case any more than him knowing what his bedroom looked like.

    Being a creeper doesn't prove anything. He had creeped her before and not killed her.

    DNA evidence was not "all around." It was impossibly absent from some places and ridiculously present in others.

    The remains were pretty clearly moved in some way. You're not fairly presenting the facts.
    Legit question: It's impossible to clean up DNA evidence?

    If I thought I was scrubbing to avoid life in prison, I would flat be meticulous. Are you saying that it is actually impossible to clean it up?

  21. #171

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    Whatever happened I'm convinced the blood came from the tube.

    I also still can't get over the dispatch call about the tags/car.
    do u even brick?

  22. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by A-Smith View Post
    What's the false negative rate for EDTA presence?
    You and I, the jury, and even the state of Wisconsin don't know. We don't know what the threshold is for the test to detect EDTA. The test itself is thus pretty meaningless in the context of a murder trial or any scientific investigation. EDTA can leave a sample when exposed to air over enough time. This test does not meet the level of transparency and reliability to be used as evidence precisely because we don't know these things. The FBI isn't telling. It was a longshot by the defense, and they cocked it up by allowing it to be presented the way it was.

    The only way to be sure would be to have controls. I.e., take blood from an EDTA tube, smear it on a surface, and leave it there for a period of time. Come back and swab it and test it. That didn't happen. What we had was a guy from the FBI who is not an expert just make a statement as one that was literally baseless.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tmac61 View Post
    I tried. I will continue to embarrass you in front of your friends.

  23. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by A-Smith View Post
    Legit question: It's impossible to clean up DNA evidence?

    If I thought I was scrubbing to avoid life in prison, I would flat be meticulous. Are you saying that it is actually impossible to clean it up?
    Yes, and it isn't terribly hard. Bleach will do it.

    Now, it is damn impossible to destroy human DNA and blood but leave behind deer blood/DNA, which is what the state of Wisconsin claims an imbecile like Avery managed to do while simultaneously burning the body right on his property and leaving the car parked on his lot.

    And no one even talks about the lack of physical evidence of any kind in the bedroom, where this alleged rape and torture took place. Where's the marks of chain on wooden bed frame? Where's the DNA? where's the splatter, or then the cleaned space where there was splatter? The alleged crime scene doesn't come close to matching the allegation of the state. It didn't happen. Avery may well be a killer, but the state didn't make a case.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tmac61 View Post
    I tried. I will continue to embarrass you in front of your friends.

  24. #174

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    Quote Originally Posted by IP View Post
    Yes, and it isn't terribly hard. Bleach will do it.

    Now, it is damn impossible to destroy human DNA and blood but leave behind deer blood/DNA, which is what the state of Wisconsin claims an imbecile like Avery managed to do while simultaneously burning the body right on his property and leaving the car parked on his lot.

    And no one even talks about the lack of physical evidence of any kind in the bedroom, where this alleged rape and torture took place. Where's the marks of chain on wooden bed frame? Where's the DNA? where's the splatter, or then the cleaned space where there was splatter? The alleged crime scene doesn't come close to matching the allegation of the state. It didn't happen. Avery may well be a killer, but the state didn't make a case.

    I talk about it. It's the biggest hole in the case. The State's entire story about how it happened couldn't have happened. Brendan's story of what happened couldn't have happened. The kid got convicted based on a confessional to a story that couldn't have happened.

    And focking A-smith says "open and shut case". Huh? He must be a cop. He still hasn't said.
    Balls deeep... "I pretty much love all of the fast and furious movies."

  25. #175
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    Pretty sure he isn't a cop. I just think folks give too much benefit of the doubt to the state. (said the socialist)
    Quote Originally Posted by Tmac61 View Post
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