POLITICS Hillary 24!

Discussion in 'Politicants' started by CardinalVol, Jan 12, 2022.

  1. IP

    IP Super Moderator

    Any constitution that allows for human slavery is shit not worth adhering to.
     
  2. Indy

    Indy Pronoun Analyst

    Yeah, let's just throw the whole thing out.
     
  3. IP

    IP Super Moderator

    I like it better when broken things get fixed, rather than harping for the days when people were treated like cattle.
     
  4. ole_orange

    ole_orange Board Simp

    Unfortunately at that point in humanity slavery had been intertwined in the human experience across the globe for thousands of years and was still a way of life economically. Even if they wanted to end slavery (which they obviously didn't do), it's not like the founding fathers had the consent of their constituents that put them in power to purge slavery at the beginning of America in the late 1700s. But it did provide the framework for people like Lincoln, Frederick Douglass and MLK to take the torch and slowly enact change that ultimately forced America to realize the ideals of its founding. (disregard all this in the event that you are being sarcastic).
     
    Joseph Brant likes this.
  5. ole_orange

    ole_orange Board Simp

    Is anyone actually harping for those days to return? Do things like the 13th amendment or giving congress the power to create laws like the Civil Rights Act not provide recourse for the original sins and shortcomings of American society? I think it is inspiring how the constitution provided a playbook that eventually created the most diverse and economically prosperous nation in human history. A culturally, racially and religiously diverse democratically elected constitutional republic like the United States is still a brilliantly radical reality worthy of admiration when you consider the grand scale that is human history.

    We take for granted that we have the privilege of living amongst neighbors with ancestral roots from every corner of the Earth. We are one of the few humans in all of history that did not have to live life under a monarchy or dictatorship. It's pretty damn awesome.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2022
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  6. Volst53

    Volst53 Super Moderator

    no.

    whatever the Right is right now isn’t going back to voting for Bush and Romney types.

    I don’t even think the love for Trump is for trump but more the message.

    Trump isn’t the river but the dam that caught a lot of pissed off people that feels left behind in this country.
     
    Joseph Brant likes this.
  7. fl0at_

    fl0at_ Humorless, asinine, joyless pr*ck

    Huh? We aren't fundamentally much different, today, than much of Europe. For all it matters, France is as much today as it was when it had a monarch, as we were at our founding. They've overhauled so much, I can't understand why we should feel more privileged for never having lived under a monarchy, when their last one was almost as long ago as our founding.
     
  8. Indy

    Indy Pronoun Analyst

    People are harping for days when people were treated like cattle? Who?

    I was under the impression that the 13th amendment was our way of fixing the broken part of the thing.

    Just because one part of a thing is broken doesn’t mean the whole thing is shit. I don’t dispose of my car every time I get a flat or the check engine light comes on.
     
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  9. ole_orange

    ole_orange Board Simp

    Why bring up just France and Europe? Why no Ottoman or Egyptian empire? Why not include China, Japan and Vietnam? Why not include North Korea or Iran? The examples are endless.

    But if you want to focus on France, the American Revolution predated and served as inspiration to the French Revolution. Just 100 years ago 4% of the entire French population-and millions more across all of Europe and Africa-died fighting the 1st World War that started as the result of a European monarch being assassinated. Pretty cool when you consider that our continent had already long ridded ourselves of European monarchs 150 years before the continent of Europe did.

    Of course I'm filled with gratitude and appreciation to be living in a country like modern America when I consider how most humans throughout the entirety of human history lived in a society with an authoritative monarch or dictator having the final say on everything. It's beautiful knowing that protestants, catholics, jews, muslim, atheist, Anglo, African, Chinese, Japanese, Shawnee, Cherokee, insert whatever background you can think of rose above the complex and tribal challenges of human history and formed a nation where everyone with ancestral roots across the world lives amongst each other peacefully through a government that allows us to choose our decision makers. Not exactly a controversial take.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2022
    Joseph Brant likes this.
  10. fl0at_

    fl0at_ Humorless, asinine, joyless pr*ck

    Why would I focus on Western philosophy countries when doing a comparison to my Western philosophy country? Why would I not include Eastern philosophy countries in my Western philosophy comparison? Well. Because Western philosophy countries are more alike than Western and Eastern philosophy countries, which are much different.

    The ideals that France used are the same ones America uses, which came out of, mostly... France. The American Revolution was no way an inspiration to the French, the French succeeded with there monarch living in their country, while ours was across a big body of water. We beat France to the punch by sheer luck. The US was also in WW1.

    Humans throughout history have little bearing on other humans today. The take is controversial because you're pimping nationalism. America is not vastly different from any other Western philosophy country on this planet, right now. The fact that they were different earlier is irrelevant to now. And now, there is no need to be so nationalistic.
     
  11. ole_orange

    ole_orange Board Simp

    Surely he's being sarcastic. If not we must identify exactly those who yearn to use the Constitution as vehicle to return to chattle slavery so that we can eradicate them into the ashbin of history.
     
  12. ole_orange

    ole_orange Board Simp

    Pretty cool that of all the western societies America got the ball rolling on ridding themselves of monarchial influence, no? The surfs of France absolutely took note of the peasant colonists of the New World rising up and vanquishing their British overlords in favor of starting their own democratically elected government. To deny this is revisionism at its finest. And on what planet is being appreciative of America freeing their citizens from the rule of monarchs and dictatorships that controlled their ancestors for hundreds/thousands of years in anyway "nationalistic"? Pimping nationalism? Lol that's funny. If anything it's a mere simple observation.
     
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  13. ole_orange

    ole_orange Board Simp

    Again, I must repeat: We take for granted that we have the privilege of living amongst neighbors with ancestral roots from every corner of the Earth. We are one of the few humans in all of history that did not have to live life under a monarchy or dictatorship. It's pretty damn awesome. I'm damn proud of how America has become the most vibrant and racially, culturally and religiously diverse society in all of human history. Acknowledging and holding gratitude for this simple reality is not a "pimping of nationalism".
     
  14. fl0at_

    fl0at_ Humorless, asinine, joyless pr*ck

    Taking the view that America got the ball rolling on getting rid of monarchies when the philosophies of the time for western nations were all heading that way is not observation, it is pimping nationalism. It's like giving credit to one day exploring the Galaxy to Star Trek. It was inevitable.

    If you think that the only reason these monarchies are gone is because America won, you're deluded by nationalism. It was inevitable.

    Had America lost. We'd be free of monarchs, today. Had France lost, they'd be free of monarchs today. Had The British always won, monarchs would still just be the empty suits they are today.

    This American exceptionalism around inevitable things is pimping nationalism.
     
    Unimane and IP like this.
  15. IP

    IP Super Moderator

    Anyone who thinks the founding constitution is perfect and that we don't follow the constitution now, is. Whether they fully realize that is what they are doing, it is. We follow the constitution right now.
     
  16. fl0at_

    fl0at_ Humorless, asinine, joyless pr*ck

    Yes, it is. Western counties all have the important parts of this belief, and they don't owe us for it, and we're not better than them because we had it first.

    Be proud of those parts of humanity that achieved this, not the NATION that did it first.
     
  17. ole_orange

    ole_orange Board Simp

    But I never said that? I merely conveyed that I'm appreciative that America did immensely help with that process, because you know... they did!
     
  18. fl0at_

    fl0at_ Humorless, asinine, joyless pr*ck

    They did not. And when others tried and asked for our help, we did not provide it.

    It was inevitable. America did not help.
     
    IP likes this.
  19. IP

    IP Super Moderator

    It ignores Ancient Greece, the Roman Republic, Florence, the low countries, etc. as well. And the people doing it probably think they are big history buffs because they repeat that lie.
     
  20. ole_orange

    ole_orange Board Simp

    Who tf is saying anything about being "better" than anyone? I simply said I'm grateful to be living in a diverse democratically elected society like America as opposed to living under a monarchy or dictatorship fueled by religious or ethnic tribalism like most humans to ever exist did! Relax, it's perfectly ok to have gratitude to be living as an American in 2021 when you ponder the fortunes of most humans throughout world history of any philosophy and era.
     

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