Rumor: President Trump to end DACA

Discussion in 'The Thunderdome' started by Tenacious D, Sep 4, 2017.

  1. fl0at_

    fl0at_ Humorless, asinine, joyless pr*ck

    And if it doesn't satisfy him, he vetos it, and that's that, because nothing is getting passed with 60s yay votes in the Senate.

    Not even worth the time to draft even a one line piece of legislation.

    Now anything he wants done as part of immigration must include DACA or it gets zero dem votes.

    So Trump just played himself out of the immigration game, for good.
     
  2. Tenacious D

    Tenacious D The law is of supreme importance, or no importance

    Perhaps it will play out in just that way. We'll see in less than 6 months.
     
  3. fl0at_

    fl0at_ Humorless, asinine, joyless pr*ck

    Let's game it just for funsies. What benefit does the left get from trying to fight this fight? Little to none.

    What benefit does the left get from Trump upending DACA? All kinds of crap to throw.

    Someone in the West, or Sanders will spit out a piece of legislation. It'll likel never see the floor. If it does it won't pass. And for 6 months the media and the left will spit fire about this, and how awful the right is to upend 30 somethings who have been in America for 2 decades.

    So unless we conclude politicians on the left actually care about Dreamers, (would you say they do?) all Trump has done is give ammunition to his detractors while actually accomplishing **** all.

    Hurray?

    The fun part is that the right actually instigated this shit show, and are somehow proud of making themselves a punchline.
     
  4. Tenacious D

    Tenacious D The law is of supreme importance, or no importance

    President Trump will be forced to act on any approved legislation given to him by Congress.

    They have 6 months from today to get it to him. Let's see what they pass, and when.
     
  5. Tenacious D

    Tenacious D The law is of supreme importance, or no importance

    Perhaps they flail for 6 months and don't pass anything, and Trump corrects their failure by extending it, despite their failure.

    Or, they do pass legislation granting permanent residency - or even a path to citizenship - and Trump says he'll sign it into law...if it's packaged with border wall funding, tax reform, and just about anything else he wants. If they dare him, he'll veto it and they'll be welcome to override his veto. If they can't override the veto, the GOP Congress can go and explain to their constituency why some of them (perhaps in leadership) really wanted amnesty, all along. The Dems can then go and explain to their special interest groups as to why Dreamers are being deported, now, because they refused to meet Trump's agenda - particularly on the wall - to prevent others from doing the same, later. I'd love to watch both sides attempt either endeavor, respectively.

    And then both sides, freshly castrated, can stand and watch both the deportations happen and the wall still being built behind them, anyway, and just as Reagan should have first required in his mid-80's amnesty deal.

    Ah, it's all just a bunch of horseshit I'm spewing. Nonsense, really. I'm just throwing GoT-like theories out there, and probably similarly goofy and half-baked. This will most likely blow up in Trump's face, just as some of you predict.

    But, unlike GoT, we'll know this outcome in 6 short months.
     
  6. Savage Orange

    Savage Orange I need ammunition, not a ride. -V Zelensky.

    The only thing I'm giving Trumpmcredit for here is his recognition that, Constitutionally speaking, he doesn't have the authority to do something like DACA and neither did Obama. The left has been pissing and moaning about Trump throwing his Presidential weight around (just like the right did about Obama and his several overreaches also...) but now that he's kicking that ball back where it belongs the left is once again throwing down the race card. Apparently the Constitution is "racist" now. Maybe we'll see some Antifa types in DC screaming at it like they've been screaming at statues the past few weeks...
     
  7. fl0at_

    fl0at_ Humorless, asinine, joyless pr*ck

    He does have the Constitutional authority to do what he did; enforcement of immigration policy is an EXECUTIVE branch decision.

    That's why many here would ALSO argue that the judiciary cannot say Trump doesn't have authority to blanket ban entry into this country through executive order.

    It cannot go both ways.
     
  8. Tenacious D

    Tenacious D The law is of supreme importance, or no importance

    Agreed. But that we're now at a place where both parties have a long history of selectively choosing which laws to enforce or obey is well-established, and neither side can claim any high ground beyond that which is both temporary and convenient. And that's incredibly dangerous, no matter who is doing it, for any reason, and toward any end - no matter how well-intended or insidious the motives.
     
  9. fl0at_

    fl0at_ Humorless, asinine, joyless pr*ck

    What we will see is any piece of legislation on immigration is going to have a rider attached that is related to DACA, which means some Republicans won't vote on it.

    Oops, there goes the small majority the right had on immigration.

    The only way immigration sees any kind of shot at law at this point is 1: Dems can't add anything, or 2: the reform package is so big we start calling it Trumpigration, and those same that refused to vote earlier do so for the larger package. (Not happening, two Republicans in the Senate are going to torpedo anything that meaningful for Trump).
     
  10. Tenacious D

    Tenacious D The law is of supreme importance, or no importance

    I'm not following. I see these two examples as going in the same direction.
     
  11. Savage Orange

    Savage Orange I need ammunition, not a ride. -V Zelensky.

    EnACTment and enFORCEment are two different things. The POTUS may well be able to enforce already existing law but enacting it in the first place is for Congress to do.
     
  12. Tenacious D

    Tenacious D The law is of supreme importance, or no importance

    My blind-assed guess is that there is a substantially higher probability that Tennesse beats Alabama by 50, than there is any chance that Congress will be able to pass any DACA-related legislation, at all, much less in 6 months. And I don't mean to infer that this is necessarily either good or bad, per de. It's just the most likely and natural outcome to expect, when considering that we have a legislative body which has been irrevocably broken by years of increasingly dogmatic (militant?) hyper-partisanship, and who now finds themselves quagmired in full-blown disarray and dysfunction.

    I also think that it's a mistake for anyone to assume that the margins on beliefs and attitudes toward immigration reform are as close as they may wish them to be, and particularly when it comes to any solution which requires either amnesty and/or conveyance of citizenship. While we all understand the imperfect nature of polls, and of the folly of seeing them as anything more than what they are - a very brief and laser-focused snapshot - but I've seen many where the the beliefs and attitudes on immigration, and it's many surrounding issues, aren't nearly as tight as some may believe. Perhaps I'm wrong, and there are a great many and reputable polls which show it to be just that close, and I'll be happy to look at any provided in response, but I have not seen none which suggest that there is sufficiently broad support for permanent residency, amnesty or a path to citizenship being granted to illegal immigrants to remain in the US, at least as of yet or which leap to mind.

    Of course, that still leaves the essential and preeminent matter of simply allowing your actions to be guided by an overarching desire to do what is right, fair and most just, however unpopular, and which no poll could likely hope to properly account for. But still, exercising those beliefs requires the amendment, addition or removal of laws, and their subsequent enforcement, and that requires that Congress will meet President Trump's challenge to actually "do its job", in the months to come. I'd love to be surprised in seeing them be capable of doing so, but will not be holding my breath while awaiting it.
     
  13. fl0at_

    fl0at_ Humorless, asinine, joyless pr*ck

    No, you don't. You see one example where the judiciary is ruling on an order as it affects American citizens, not the order itself.

    The other you are seeing complaints against the order itself, and it affects no American citizens.
     
  14. fl0at_

    fl0at_ Humorless, asinine, joyless pr*ck

    No law was enacted. It was simply orders not to enforce, under certain criteria.
     
  15. Savage Orange

    Savage Orange I need ammunition, not a ride. -V Zelensky.

    So Obama did an end-around... In any event, my thought is that Congress won't get anything done and it'll be dropped back in Trumps lap. He'll most likely extend or grandfather in current Dreamers and either not allow anybmore to sign up or tighten the window so that very few will be able to. All the while Congress will be [itch bay]ing loudly about how hard they're having to work and calling Trump a raaaaaaaacist...
     
  16. fl0at_

    fl0at_ Humorless, asinine, joyless pr*ck

    He could just do that now and then not have to hear the botching and such. But if he decides to play politics, he can't complain that the other side is too.
     
  17. Savage Orange

    Savage Orange I need ammunition, not a ride. -V Zelensky.

    Trump would do well in that case to go ahead and cut to the chase. He's out of his league trying to play politics.
     
  18. Savage Orange

    Savage Orange I need ammunition, not a ride. -V Zelensky.

    You know you're a Tennessee fan when "[itch bay]ing" gets autocorrected to "botching"....
     
  19. VolDad

    VolDad Super Moderator

    .

     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2017
  20. Savage Orange

    Savage Orange I need ammunition, not a ride. -V Zelensky.

    Ok to blame wypipo... Errrthing the fault of wypipo...
     

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