POLITICS Ukraine

Discussion in 'Politicants' started by CardinalVol, Jan 22, 2022.

  1. IP

    IP Super Moderator

    Does nato say anything about democratic principles? I think it is mutual defense and stability. If Hungary stays stable and doesn't violate neighbors' sovereignty then they are not breaking any nato rules that I know of.
     
  2. VolDad

    VolDad Super Moderator

    Russia Warns Sweden, Finland Against Joining NATO

    Well, I guess they gave Russia their answer, "Russia, Go [uck fay] Yourself!"
     
    tvolsfan and NorrisAlan like this.
  3. Poppa T

    Poppa T Vol Geezer

  4. A-Smith

    A-Smith Chieftain

  5. Unimane

    Unimane Kill "The Caucasian"

    Well, Hungary is notably creating ties/sympathies with Russia. However, yes, I think it is in our interest to not create a protective umbrella for authoritarian rulers. Doing so was one of the great disasters of our Cold War policies and instigated significant upheaval throughout the world, particularly the poorer regions of Asia, Africa, and South America.
     
  6. IP

    IP Super Moderator

    okay, TIL.
     
  7. XXROCKYTOPXX

    XXROCKYTOPXX Chieftain


    By far the funniest thing I've seen today. Bravo!
     
    Poppa T likes this.
  8. Savage Orange

    Savage Orange I need ammunition, not a ride. -V Zelensky.

    I think what we’re seeing here is a glimpse into a future where the US is no longer the leader of the world… we still have time to get it together but that time is quickly ticking by.
     
  9. A-Smith

    A-Smith Chieftain

    I don’t really think we can change this or ever could. GDP per capita is converging. Poorer countries are catching up due to the expansion of capitalism and absorption of technology. New tech progress is slower than 50 years ago. Countries that don’t share western values are growing economically faster than we are. Since we are (rightly) committed to no empire, we cannot expect to stay dominant. The struggle in Iraq likely sped this up. China has taken what they like from us (economic freedom) and disregarded the rest (civil liberties). I think more investment in SDI is in order because there is at least a double digit percentage likelihood of nuclear war in the next century according to futurologists.
     
    IP likes this.
  10. VolDad

    VolDad Super Moderator

    It is being reported that the Russian warship Moskva (Moscow), told to [uck fay] itself, has been hit and possibly sunk by Ukraine.
     
    justingroves likes this.
  11. VolDad

    VolDad Super Moderator

  12. IP

    IP Super Moderator

    .
     
  13. tvolsfan

    tvolsfan Chieftain

    The whole unipolar thing was always going to be temporary. That’s why acknowledging the reality of globalization and building alliances (with the right allies) is so important.
     
    A-Smith likes this.
  14. VolDad

    VolDad Super Moderator

    It is the Flagship of the Russian Black Sea Fleet. Guided missile cruiser with a range of about 400 miles. Admiral who runs navel operations in the Black Sea and over 500 souls would have been on board.
     
  15. Savage Orange

    Savage Orange I need ammunition, not a ride. -V Zelensky.

    As I understand it, the crew was evacuated before the ship sunk. How many died on impact, who knows?
     
  16. Savage Orange

    Savage Orange I need ammunition, not a ride. -V Zelensky.

    True, but no group of nations are going to be equally yoked. There is going to be at least one alpha dog in the pack. Traditionally, that has been the US but that role appears to be fading.
     
  17. Volst53

    Volst53 Super Moderator

    The US will be fine not running everything, but there's going to be a lot smaller countries that will suffer due to our role in ensuring shipping lanes on energy and food.
     
    A-Smith likes this.
  18. tvolsfan

    tvolsfan Chieftain

    Can you elaborate? I’m not sure what you mean. If you’re implying the invasion of Ukraine is a result of the US growing weaker, I don’t agree at all.
     
  19. Savage Orange

    Savage Orange I need ammunition, not a ride. -V Zelensky.

    I think that’s a component of it. Putin has done pretty much whatever he has wanted to do for years now. We’ve talked about “red lines” and whatnot the whole time also and when those lines have been immediately crossed by Russia, we’ve done exactly nothing about it. Every time Putin hollers “muh nukes!!!” we’ve backed off. Sanctions? Great, but go all the way. Tell the rest of the world “you can do business with Russia or the US, but not both”. Stop playing keep away with the heavy equipment Ukraine needs to defend themselves. Ukraine has shown that it is very capable of defending itself, given the materials it needs to do so. When we refuse to do that out of fear of what Putin “might” do… we’re showing weakness. We’ve already seen what dealing with Russia weakly will accomplish. Time to try a different tack.
     
  20. fl0at_

    fl0at_ Humorless, asinine, joyless pr*ck

    By chance, did you consider us "weak" or "weakening" during the Cold War, when we let this exact thing happen for exactly the same reason?
     
    tvolsfan likes this.

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