COVID-19 (artist formerly known as Wuhan strain novel Corona virus)

Little chance that this survives the courts, so much ado about nothing.

 

Only because of the federal source. States can and will create mandates. Some states won't. Those states will reap that.

 

I think that prior infection or vaccination should be sufficient. The question is durability of course. Perhaps natural immunity lasts less time, perhaps more. But a vaccine within x months or documented infection within y months should be treated equivalently.

 

There is probably a way it can survive courts, which would be to require anyone that does business with the Federal government to have its workforce vaccinated (in the same way that the work force must be drug tested).

When you start getting into the banking aspect, which the Fed is within its legal rights to regulate, and/or saying lending institutions that do business with unvaccinated businesses can not borrow from the Fed... you'd start seeing businesses willingly tell their employees to shoot up.

 

Seems like that shouldn’t hold water since the White House exempted the USPS

 

You're a 1099 sub now

 

Yes, with increased revenue

 

lol, no. Already, the states lagging in vaccination rate are not recovering as fast as those who have the higher rates.

Most adults are vaccinated. There is a vocal minority of 30 % of people who continue to act as a vector and reservoir for the virus that affects kids and break throughs.

 

Your Polio comparison just doesn’t work, man. With Polio, the 25% who would see significant problems were unknown and unpredictable. Everyone was looking at the same 1/4 chance of significant negative impact. That’s like playing Russian roulette. It makes sense to cover everyone.

With Covid, we know that there are some particular groups who are statistically very unlikely to be hospitalized and/or die. I mean, hell, there’s a reason they rolled out the vaccines by age group - because we knew who was at high risk and who wasn’t. It doesn’t mean that 0 people in those low risk groups will be hospitalized or die, but the risk is substantially lower, to the point where those groups should be able to evaluate the risk and make their own decision about the vaccine. It’s not like I’m telling them not to get it or that they can’t get it. I just don’t like the idea of forcing it.

When has the federal government mandated vaccines for everyone before? My understanding is that state governments can and have, which is fine to me. Federal government is a different story.

You can say they should do that all you want. But if you think forcing them to find a new means to feed their families is less restrictive that preventing people from going to a restaurant without proof of vaccination, I’m not really sure how to respond. Like, I don’t think the two things are even remotely close. It’s mind boggling to me that you could think that.

And that doesn’t even touch on what it does to the businesses themselves. $14k fine per person? Who pays for the testing if companies don’t want to comply? And again, who are we paying to waste time and money to track this shit?

 

I do believe there is validity to the idea a big part of this move was to provide cover for businesses to institute mandates. I'd wager most of them want to do it and the federal government just gave them a reason to move. At least most of the medium-large to large companies.

 

The polio thing really works, and your view on COVID is consistent with why we are still stacking up bodies. There is no point in me answering your questions because you just don't really care what the answers are.

How do they feed their families when there are lockdowns, or they are dead? They don't. Your mind is often boggled and immutable, consistently. You ask questions, and don't like the answers. Like saying a polio comparison "doesn't really work" when it is the same situation, just in the "information" era.

 

But how can people feed their families if they can't contaminate their workplace?

 

It's a workers economy at present. Plenty of options out there.

 

I'm really trying to think how this is supposed to work. My coworkers have the RIGHT to cause the office to have to quarantine when they get COVID and expose everyone? To feed their families, they MUST expose everyone else to COVID when there is a vaccine that would lower the risk of any transmission readily available and fully vetted by the FDA? Why do they have this right to cause other families to not get fed when business is shut down or we can't safely meet with clients or someone gets killed? What about everyone else's rights?

 

You saying the Polio example works doesn’t make it so. I’ve explained, repeatedly, why it doesn’t work. It’s not really all that comparable. One caused significant harm indiscriminately, and they other largely affects specific populations.

I don’t really care that we are stacking up bodies when those bodies are pretty consistently the bodies of those who made the choice not to vaccinate. Do I wish they had gotten vaccinated? Of course. But I definitely don’t think it’s my place, or your place, or Joe Biden’s place to force those people to vaccinate against their will.

Vaccinated people and people in low risk groups are still extremely unlikely to be hospitalized or die from Covid. Not impervious, but extremely extremely unlikely.

There shouldn’t be any lockdowns because every adult person has access to the vaccine. If they choose not to vaccinate and die as a result, that’s on them.

 

It's been happening about once a month for a year and we probably have only 10 % of the people in the office at any given time. It's just not sustainable, and it seems to ONLY be the people who are not vaccinated that are keeping it going. So get vaccinated or find another job seems really, really not that crazy. It seems pretty reasonable.

 

You saying it doesn't work doesn't make it so either, bro. You don't know anything about polio or you wouldn't have asked what you did, because it compares quite [uck fay]ing favorably that 75% of people have no symptoms at all. COVID DEFINITELY causes significant harm indiscriminately. That you think it doesn't is why 20 somethings are getting [uck fay]ed up lungs for life or dying. It's stupid.

That you don't care is absolutely crystal clear. That is the difference between our positions: me, caring and you, not caring. What you seem to not understand or not care about is that not everyone CAN get vaccinated and are endangered by others refusing for no rational reason and also refusing to change their behaviors to avoid spreading it. Kids under 12 can't be vaccinated. Many people with health issues either can't be vaccinated or are still prone to break throughs and bad outcomes. What about their rights? This is drunk driving or seat belt laws, not apartheid.

 

Then advocate for your company to make it mandatory. If individual private companies want to mandate the vaccine, then by all means, they should do so. Mine did, and I have no problem with it at all. I’ve been vaccinated for months now.

But [uck fay] the federal government forcing it on private companies who have chosen not to require their employees get vaccinated.

 

If you infect 100 people with Covid, 50 of them 20 years old and healthy, the other 50 85 years old or 65+ and unhealthy, the second group will, without question, experience a far higher percentage of significant issues.

If you infect 100 people with Polio, 50 of them 20 years old and healthy, the other 50 85 years old or 65+ and unhealthy, can you say with confidence that one group will, without question, experience a far higher percentage of significant issues? Would the data back that up?

It’s a bad comparison.

 

The difference between our positions is that you want to control what people do, and I don’t.

I want every person on earth to have access to the vaccine. I want every person on earth to be properly educated about the vaccine and why they should get it. I would LOVE for every person on earth to get the vaccine. But, if after being given access and education, some people choose not to get the vaccine, that’s the end of it for me. I trust people to make their own decisions about their health and then live with the consequences.