Connecticut Shootings, Christmastime, and Christianity

No it was a solid double. At least.

 

Honestly, I understand IP, and I understand his point of view. He's at odds with the most prominent religion in our country. Not only that, but a good chunk of those in the religion say he is in big trouble with the creator of the universe one day. Quite frankly, I understand the anger and am not offended.

To me it seems reasonable/likely that Jesus rose from the dead 2000 years ago given what we know about first century history. That's what I take as my starting point. I am open to the possibility that I am wrong. But as I orient my worldview around Jesus and his followers' teachings, I will naturally believe things like the blog from the OP. If Jesus spoke truth/is truth then nothing about the OP is stupid or disgusting. That's why I prefaced the OP as "for those who believe the gospel." But as someone who wants others to see Christ like I do, I would rather IP be engaged than disengaged.

 

I'm wondering why you can't see why some of Christian faith feel attacked.

 

IP you've said on numerous times that you have read the Bible. If you have then you should understand just where in fact people's belief in Good v. Evil, Jesus v. Satan come from. I believe in a spiritual world that is beyond our scope of thought, much less vision. The Bible does teach of spiritual warfare in high places. It teaches that demons do enter into people and even have teachings where Jesus cast out demons. If you have not read these parts, then this is where we are getting our beliefs.

 

Because if you are strong enough in your beliefs, why would you give a damn what some faithless hippie, who only likes to argue and push people's buttons, says? Especially when he says it in the same way all the time?

I don't give a shit if IP thinks I'm stupid for believing in God. I don't see why you do either. If anything, you should be laughing inside at how narrow his vision is.

 

Most "demons" can be diagnosed as mental illnesses nowadays, I think is what he is saying. Don't quote me on that though... I don't wanna speak for the guy.

 

So it's now common courtesy to mock others beliefs. Thanks for the lesson Indy.

 

I strongly agree with your last two sentences (although there may be some difference in how we view what sin is).

 

I can get behind this.

 

Doesn't the scientific idea of multiple dimensions beyond the 3/4 that we experience lend itself to a space/time for other beings that are unobservable to us?

 

Then just what did Jesus cast out and make these people whole again?

 

That's not what my post said.

 

I have a few ideas but won't get into it here.

 

I understand where the beliefs come from biblically, but we know so much more about the human mind and brain now. So much of what used to be spirits and demons are now known disorders and imbalances. And there is still nothing concrete concerning spirits or demons. I mean, can Bipolar disorder or epilepsy be cast out? Doesn't seem to be able to, given the numbers of people who still suffer from them, many of which are believers.

THIS is the discussion I was assuming was coming, rather than all of the noise on the last few pages.

 

I find this to be the most offensive thing you've ever written, and by a wide margin.

Your position is as welcome, valuable and worthy of consideration as anyone else's, despite however many others dis/agree with you, or how strongly.

But so is everyone else's, too.

And while you are certainly free - welcomed, even - to state your opinion, so too are they free to subject it to their own scrutiny, to dis/agree with it, and to choose whether they wish to support or oppose it, according to their own standards and beliefs. They can no more be made to accept your beliefs, as they could force you to believe theirs. It's impossible to extend those rights to some, and not others, IP.

While each person has a right to express their own beliefs, that's where it ends. There is no right that it will be accepted, heeded, or even considered. And it certainly doesn't guarantee or require that it will be agreeable, popular, liked or even appreciated - even if it's right ("right" meaning correct) - but simply that you have a right to believe it, and say it.

 

If he could heal leprosy, why couldn't he heal a brain disorder?

 

I don't know, nor will I claim to ever know what happened during that time. My reason for skepticism in the bible is the same as my reason for skepticism in religion as a whole. Humans are flawed. It was written by humans (yeah, i know they were "guided" by the Holy Spirit, and blah blah blah), so I have trouble trusting it and believing it as factual.

 

Of course not, but it may as well have said that. Ip's views do not affect mine in any way. The arrogance and fervor he takes to condemn my beliefs and call them idiocy is what bothers me. It's festivus Indy. This is the airing of grievances.

 

Maybe the most astute post in the entire thread.

I would only add....nor does he need to.

 

Superstition is, by definition, founded upon ignorance. Again, if words like superstition and idiocy are the best words you can bring, don't be surprised at the lack of respect you get in return.