The Indy Talks To Himself (NBA) Thread.

Yes, because they had Jordan.

Talk about regular season silliness all day (ask Golden State how well the regular season records stack up) - how many rings did that "loaded" Bulls team win when while he was there? And when he wasn't? And how many when he returned?

That's your answer.

 

/thread

/debate

 

Bullshit

 

Not you.
But many many people who had a dislike for Lebron but were lacking the ability formulate coherent thoughts. They feel the need to at least make an attempt at minimizing those championships. It was the best they could do. I sometimes peruse tigerdroppings. You'll find them over here, though this particular species of sportsfanhater may soon go extinct on account of diminished argumentative resources.

 

Yes I do.

 

You think the Sasha Pavlovic Cavs are beating the Spurs if they have Jordan? The MJ mythology is way out of control

 

I'm assuming you guys think I'm saying they'd miss the playoffs or something, in which case read the thread. If you're really talking about the Finals, you're insane.

 

That's a stupid question. No champion is a champion without its best player. What have Wade and Bosh done since LeBron left?

The Bulls had a supporting cast that was better than anyone else's. They don't need to win a title without Jordan for me to say that.

 

You'd lose. Building an all time team to beat another one, you'd lose. A weak shooting guy that has to get to the house against a team with Wilt or Kareem in his prime gets housed. I'd take Shaq as a basis over LeBron. For sure Kareem, Magic and Wilt.

 

Pippen. Rodman was the best at what he did. I don't remember the rest of the guys being all that special, although they fit together well

 

Whoa. Those teams had more than that.

 

I take Lebron over MJ and I"m not kidding. I'll take MJ for the last five minutes, but for the entire game, give me Lebron. He's a more versatile player than MJ, and he's just a way way better facilitator. Lebron has a substantial percentage of Magic in him, but with the added bonus that he's a significantly better defender. I think Magic is amazeballs, and I don't see how anyone would seriously consider taking him over Lebron.

What Lebron lacks is what some might characterize as a lack of a killer instinct. I view it slightly differently. What Lebron lacks is "go to" shot. MJ knew that he could always always get his turnaround off, and that it was probably going in. When it comes to end of game killer instinct, that's half the battle. Lebron is an average jumpshooter and he knows it, so his "go to" becomes blowing by his defender and then beasting his way to the rack. He's very very good at this, mind you. Probably the best ever. But in crunchtime the degree of difficulty associated with that strategy ramps up substantially. Lebron knows this as well. He's a smart basketball player. His game doesn't perfectly lend itself to just flipping a switch for the last five minutes of the game like MJ and going with the Jimmy Chitwood "spread the floor, give it to to him at the top of the key" offense.

This is a point I am conceding, and it is no doubt a criticism of Lebron's game, but way way way too much is made of it. A game isn't decided in the last five minutes nearly as often if it's out of reach well before then. It's not some statistical glitch that adding Lebron James to a given team makes them 30 wins better than they were, while adding MJ to a given team makes them at least 2 games better...and probably more than that if the team is bad, but certainly not 30. And it's also why adding Kobe Bryant to a given team makes them zero wins better and maybe a few worse, and this was true in his absolute prime too.

Whether or not one selects centers with their first overall pick speaks more to their fundamental worldview on the game. If you were inclined to select a center, I can't disparage such a selection, but it's not one that I would make myself. I'd go with Lebron, Bird, Magic, and MJ over

Also, I"m not sure I even agree with your rating of centers. Isn't prime Shaq a better player than Chamberlain? Is Russell really better than Olajuwon? etc. etc.

 

I guess that's why centers are so dominant in the modern game.

Oh wait.

So I guess what I"m saying is: nah, you'd lose.

 

Are you suggesting that tossing the ball over to someone for a contested 3 has ever been something other than an assist?*

Are they also getting more lenient in the way they assign guys with blocks, steals, and rebounds? Because, if so, then that totally explains why Lebron is the first guy to lead all players from both teams in every single one of those categories over the entirety of the NBA finals. Stat inflation...it's just like grade inflationin law school except instead of applying to all students in a particular class, it applies only to Lebron James.

Yup, that's it. You've cracked the code.


*I vividly remember the assist that Magic got to break (I believe) the NBA's all-time assist record. I was a very young man at the time, but it sticks out my head because it was only then that i realized how lenient a stat assists were. Magic basically just threw it down to Kareem who then created his own shot with some maneuvering and the passing of several seconds. I distinctly remember thinking at the time that it was BS that they gave Magic an assist for that.* But they did., because that's just how they work, and always have.


*I was an independent thinker even as a young man, it seems.

 

And renders it moot to boot.

 

I'll gladly take insanity here

 

It's not really a myth, it happened for years in the NBA.

 

There aren't any of those guys, right now, though, are there? If there was a KA-J in the league I'm not sure many teams would have someone to deal with him.

 

Yes, Jud Buechler.

 

His first three peat, with Pippen and Grant, was a better team than his 2nd three peat I think.