Obamacare

Today's the day...what's everyone thinking?

 

Struck down.

 

Hopefully.

 

Let me rephrase that - I think the individual mandate will be struck down. I don't think the entire thing will.

 

Hopefully struck down.

 

Mixed. I want universal healthcare but I dont. It would be good for factory based industries and/or companies with large payrolls. It would bring back jobs to the USA. On the other hand, the version passed seems pretty terrible although you never know how it will actually be put in application after all the regs are written. I do understand Government is likely to mismanage healthcare but we desperately need to bring back factory jobs to this country. I think healthcare should remain private for much of the market but regulated. People who choose to become obese and smoke should have to pay much more. The surcharges right now are not enough. And people who are in reasonable shape should pay less then they do now. I am sick of paying for people who choose to be unhealthy.

 

Unskilled labor isn't coming back to this country. That shark has been jumped.

 

It's not popular, but I want universal coverage. The current law is nothing but a subsidy for insurance companies. I do applaud the attempt- healthcare reform has been attempted since Truman's administration by Republicans and Democrats. We've had this discussion before, and you guys know my reasoning for thinking the way I do. No use getting into that again.

One aspect on public opinion that I find interesting is that the majority say they oppose the plan, yet when asked about the individual parts, they agree with most of it. The individual mandate is the hangup. Individual responsibility is preached by the opposition. To me, the individual mandate makes each person more responsible for their care. Those with insurance are paying for the uninsured that use the ER as a family physician. Most can't pay; thus, those of us that can, pay for them. It has to be addressed somehow. Rising healthcare costs are a contributing factor to our economic woes, and it's only going to get worse.

 

Why do we desperately need factory jobs? I think we'd be better off employing the millions of unemployed college grads in jobs that will certainly pay more than a factory job.

Also I'm not following the logic that healthcare brings back jobs. This mandate will cost manufacturers billions.

 

I think our healthcare system as is currently has many issues. Not denying that. I also don't think there is one magic fix that can fix it, and both sides have legit concerns and issues. I think it's a culmination of many of the issues raised. I just don't like this particular law for several reasons.

As I understand it, if you grant this under the Commerce Clause, the federal government will have more potential power than any American should be comfortable with. That's scary to me.

I don't particularly like how it handles pre-existing conditions in general (I realize there are specific outliers to this).

And finally, quite frankly, I don't trust DC to be able to handle and administer this.

 

The individual mandate is the ultimate moral hazard. I would have gladly paid the fine and waited till i got sick when i was younger and millions will do the same. As for the rhetoric that people like the individual parts of the bill, but it just got bad marketing or something that's bull. None of those surveys mentioned cost. All they asked was if you support uninsured people having access to healthcare. Of course we'd all be in favor of everyone getting healthcare as long as we arent paying for it.

 

The clause about pre-existing conditions is very popular. Keeping children on their parent's insurance until age 26 is very popular. There are others. The Obama administration didn't fight for public approval. They got outhustled by the Republicans. The deal breaker is the individual mandate.

I see your concerns over the mandate. I share some of them. In the end, you can't force people to do/not do anything. You can only make them wish they did/didn't do certain things.

Cardinal, I share some of your sentiments. I don't trust government either. Probably not to your level, but there's distrust nonetheless. I have a greater distrust for insurance companies whose goal is to make money for their shareholders. They can manipulate their profits by denying legit claims to increase profit margin. Some companies have policies in place to deny all initial claims. That's immoral at best and should be illegal. We are talking about folks that pay for a service and are denied what they pay for. It's fraud for the sake of more money at the expense of a human being's health. The consumer has little recourse in these situations. They can file suit, but given the money of the insurance industry, they can draw out the process. All the while, the patient gets sicker or worse. The normal laws of capitalism do not work on the insurance companies. Way too much power is held by them. What good are concepts of freedom and individual liberties if one is dead and can't enjoy them?

 

I'm not a cold-blooded capitalist when it comes to healthcare. I fully agree with a lot of your concerns. I just don't think Obamacare is the right answer. I'm just not sure it's going to fix anything and at the same time just create another expense in the process.

 

Struck down. But I never trust the court when it comes to the commerce clause.

 

Mandate tossed.

 

May have servived as a tax, conflicting reports.

 

Its upheld as a tax.

 

Wow.

 

Roberts joins the left and says its constitutional.

 

Wait. What the hell happened?