16 yr old defense in DUI deaths --- "Affluenza"

There is nothing worse than a rule/law that society is either unwilling or unable to enforce. It undermines all rules/laws, so make them carefully.

 

But not as severe as the discrepancy between waiting in the bushes to snipe a guy out when he walks out his door vs. a 16 year old driving while intoxicated.

 

Consequence must play a role. If I get in a fight, I go to jail whether my intentions were to fight or not. If I get in a fight that results in another's unjustified death, I go to jail for a lot longer regardless of intent.

 

But incarceration's primary function is as a punishment, and not to deter further bad acts.

 

I sell guns...
I keep a loaded weapon at home...

I agree with 2. Same issue. Recklessness isn't murder.

 

Why shouldn't both be considered?

I neither believe that simply drinking and driving nor underage consumption should warrant a 20 year prison sentence. But murdering four people should easily require that, IMO.

And it's not like his drinking and driving had the potential to kill four people...he actually killed for human beings...after underage consumption and drinking and driving.

 

If solely punishment, our current incarceration system is an utter disaster. My problem is that in the other end of the punishment, you actually do have a hardened criminal.

I'm for punishment in the form of repayment to society. Sending this kid to prison would assure us of a true criminal years from now.

The sentence was absurd, but our ridiculous interpretation of cruel punishment has made actual punishment silly.

 

Is that a fact?

 

Doesn't murder require mens rea?

 

The respective intent of each must be considered, but you can't ignore that the end result is the same, however they intended it.

 

Agreed. Driving drunk isn't inherently wrong.

Let me re-phrase, since "wrong," "bad" and other words are being randomly thrown about, and then attempted to be properly defined when it suits one view over another.

"Drinking and driving is as equally ILLEGAL, and as equally chargeable, regardless of whether it occurs on a public road that is devoid of all life, traffic and anything else, save yourself... and the interstate."

 

Keeping a loaded gun at home is fine if it is done responsibly, as is operating a large machine that is capable traveling at a high rate of speed. Now, if you keep the loaded gun between your headboard and mattress in a home with small children, you have acted recklessly. If the unthinkable happens, is it murder?

I am not sure. I think a woman got put away for second degree murder for that exact situation recently. But the punishment didn't seem out of line, even if the semantics of the conviction are fuzzy to me.

 

Again, but what is it that you're punishing, the action or the results that flowed therefrom? What punishment do you give the kid if he was dead sober?

 

I think the point is intent, which is the foundation for much of our punishment system. Said system is broken.

 

Death penalty vs 20 years with parole...

Still pretty big discrepancy.

 

I don't see this as simple. Recklessness is a problem, but our prison system as it is today turns a dumbass into a legit thug on the other end.

 

I am willing to guarantee that this guy would not kill another person while drinking and driving for the duration of his time in prison.

Doesn't that help society?

And we won't have a "true criminal" in 20 years - we have that right now. I'll worry about him in 20 years, but for the interim, the interests of the public will be best served by his absence from society.

 

So?

 

No, sorry, pure IMO.

 

Was the collision the result of negligence, if he is dead sober?

Could such a collision even occur in that exact way if one were completely sober and not distracted in any way? I think not, but I am open to some speculation as to how it could. I mean, alert sober drivers are not plowing into the only other vehicle on the road when it is motionless. I would think an accident of this nature is only possible through either some sort of negligence, malice, or personal medical incident (sudden seizure or something).