You can’t be pro-life and pro-gun.

Discussion in 'The Thunderdome' started by VolDad, May 2, 2016.

  1. VolDad

    VolDad Super Moderator

    The American obsession with guns just doesn't square with biblical teaching.

    But I disagree with my community’s wholesale embrace of the idea that anyone should be able to buy a gun. For one thing, our commitment to the sanctity of human life demands that we err on the side of reducing threats to human life. And our belief in the basic sinfulness of humankind should make us skeptical of the NRA’s slogan, “the only way to stop a bad guy with a gun is with a good guy with a gun.” The Bible indicates that we are all bad guys sometimes.

    Additionally, anyone using a gun for defense must be ready to kill. Such a posture is antithetical to the term “evangelical,” which refers to the “evangel,” or gospel. The gospel begins with God’s love for every human, and calls on Christians to be more Christ-like. At no time did Jesus use deadly force. Although he once allowed his disciples to defend themselves with “a sword,” that permission came with a limitation on the number of weapons they could possess. Numerous Bible passages, such as Exodus 22:2-3, strictly limit the use of deadly force.
  2. IP

    IP Advanced Pruitt Apologetics Bot

    Nothing about someone who is "pro-life" has ever made any sense. The very name is a ridiculous starting point, as it paints anyone who disagrees as somehow being "against life."
  3. warhammer

    warhammer Chieftain

    Because pro-choice is less politically motivated...
  4. VolDad

    VolDad Super Moderator

    I saw him on CBS Sunday Morning. Apparently a documentary is coming out about him.

    Some of the basis of his argument; "Is it always Gods "Will" that I survive a violent confrontation".
  5. cotton

    cotton Stand-up Philosopher

    While I don't hold that particular view, your abrasive ramblings show your ignorance again. You are simply a ******** who spouts a lot of liberal slogans.
  6. NorrisAlan

    NorrisAlan Super Moderator

    The "God's will" argument smacks of nihilism. No thanks.
  7. cotton

    cotton Stand-up Philosopher

    I don't really understand his argument that having the ability to defend yourself is anti-Christian. If that is his belief, there is a very simple way of exercising it; nobody requires him to own or carry a gun.

    I am also convinced that I have no idea what the term "evangelical" means.
  8. Beechervol

    Beechervol Super Moderator

    Good reason for that.
  9. Tar Volon

    Tar Volon Me Blog

    This is silly. You're assuming their position is wrong and then using its (unproven) falsity to claim it's nonsense.

    From their own perspectives, both the pro-choice and pro-life names make perfect sense. If you assume their opponents are correct, "pro-life" is silly and disingenuous and "pro-choice" is monstrous.
  10. JohnnyQuickkick

    JohnnyQuickkick Great Man

    I could kill a man with a knife, my bare hands, or merely the power of my mind. what do i do with all these deadly weapons
  11. Tar Volon

    Tar Volon Me Blog

    Also, while I think you can make a Christian argument for gun control, there are lots of ways in which it makes sense to be both pro-gun and pro-life. The simplest is from a libertarian ideology in which basically everything is allowed unless it directly harms someone else.
  12. Volst53

    Volst53 Super Moderator

    That article has some really dumbass logic and reasoning
  13. bigpapavol

    bigpapavol Super Moderator

    Just the piece that VD highlighted was idiotic. Didn't warrant reading further.
  14. droski

    droski Super Moderator

    and the term pro choice isn't just as silly?
  15. IP

    IP Advanced Pruitt Apologetics Bot

    I don't think you're applying the word "ignorance" correctly. If you think I'm simply a string of asterisks who spouts a lot of liberal slogans, you should probably just put me on ignore. I'm just all prickly and mean.
  16. IP

    IP Advanced Pruitt Apologetics Bot

    Deconstruct it. A woman has a right to choose what happens to her body at any time. The counter to that is that there are circumstances where she no longer has a choice. Is that unfair? Is there another way you would phrase it?

    Once that is settled, try and phrase "pro-life" in a way that isn't producing a red herring when placed in the context of guns, war, self defense, etc.
  17. IP

    IP Advanced Pruitt Apologetics Bot

    Sounds like it triggers cognitive dissonance in some.
  18. Tar Volon

    Tar Volon Me Blog

    It should be illegal to intentionally take an innocent life. That's consistent in every context you mentioned, and it took about five seconds to come up with
  19. IP

    IP Advanced Pruitt Apologetics Bot

    You it is that simple, I don't. What does "innocent life" mean? How do I measure innocence,and where does one draw the line regarding life? Note that you didn't even say human life, just life. Seems pretty complicated.

    XXROCKYTOPXX Chieftain

    As Christians we are to preserve life....seems silly to say this but that does include our own. I understand what Schenck is saying but disagree with his conclusion in general. Yes, Christians are to preserve life, love everyone, and pray for enemies but that does not mean we are expected sing Kumbaya around a camp fire and be pushovers. His own reference in Exodus 22:2 makes it clear that self defense (lethal) is not wrong. As far as dealing with gun ownership, I would think Jesus telling the disciples to sell their cloaks and buy a sword if they didn't have one in Luke 22:36 would put that to rest.

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