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I don't disagree at all. You should reap rewards for your hard work. Everyone should.

Our world is complex. I don't like the prospects of folks having kids who can't support them either. I hate what would happen if there wasn't help for those kids even more. Bottom line is, we are all human beings. Human beings like to get their freak on. Babies will be the result without access to reproductive healthcare/prevention. Banning abortion will explode this problem exponentially. Now, I would never choose abortion, but banning it would be disasterous. It would be awesome to not need it, but we live in reality. Without it, more babies who will need support will be born, and regardless how bad some may think it is, I will never believe that our country would let babies starve if we can help it. Sometimes we're only left with choosing between bad options. To find real solutions to real problems, we all, myself foremost, are going to have to drop the tribalism stuff and work together. To quote Abraham Lincoln, "A house divided cannot stand."

 

"To whom much is given, from him much is expected"

I like sharing. It makes me feel good to share and be able to see the difference I can make.

I believe in paying a fair share to the government. 50%+ percent is not fair.

In addition it angers me immensely to hearing liberals claim I do not pay my fair share. It must be the first thing Democratic candidates are taught to say. [uck fay] them.

 

White, black, it doesn't matter, we're a country obsessed with stupid shit

 

Let's include the whole verse of Luke 12:48, not just a piece of it.

Luke 12:48
48 But the one who does not know and does things deserving punishment will be beaten with few blows. From everyone who has been given much, much will be demanded; and from the one who has been entrusted with much, much more will be asked.*

Let's examine this in context. Jesus was talking about using whatever gifts, talents, wealth, whatever to glorify the Kingdom of God.

Here's the full parable:

Who then is the faithful and wise steward, whom his lord will set over his household, to give them their portion of food at the right times?* Blessed is that servant whom his lord will find doing so when he comes. Truly I tell you, that he will set him over all that he has. But if that servant says in his heart, 'My lord delays his coming,' and begins to beat the menservants and the maidservants, and to eat and drink, and to be drunken, then the lord of that servant will come in a day when he isn't expecting him, and in an hour that he doesn't know, and will cut him in two, and place his portion with the unfaithful. That servant, who knew his lord's will, and didn't prepare, nor do what he wanted, will be beaten with many stripes, but he who didn't know, and did things worthy of stripes, will be beaten with few stripes. To whomever much is given, of him will much be required; and to whom much was entrusted, of him more will be asked.

— Luke 12:35-48

Some commentary on the verse:

The idea of “to whom much is given, much will be required” is that we are held responsible for what we have. If we are blessed with talents, wealth, knowledge, time, and the like, it is expected that we use these well to glorify God and benefit others.*


More clarity on our responsibility of using our blessings for the right purposes.
1 Peter 4:10
Each of you should use whatever gift you have received to serve others*, as faithful stewards of God’s grace in its various forms.

Jesus didn't scold the 5,000 who came to hear his sermon near Bethsaida shortly after the death of John the Baptist for not bringing their own food. He didn't tell them to get off their lazy butts and get their own food. He took 5 loaves and 2 fish, blessed them, and distributed (for free) the food for all with baskets of food left over.

Jesus' words and teachings are consistent throughout the New Testament. He came to teach love. He came to teach sacrifice. He came to teach caring for others. He taught these things precisely because that's what God has done for all mankind. He loves us so much that he sent His son to teach us His nature, then allowed that perfect example to be sacrificed to atone for all the sin of anyone who will call upon His name. After that, we are to go out into the world and try to live our lives in way that reflect His mercy and love. Jesus didn't associate with the haughty pharisees. He didn't seek out worldly riches and comfort. He sought out the outcasts, the downtrodden, the sinners, etc. He did that so He could show them love, forgiveness, and acceptance. He sought out to meet whatever need they had not because they were worthy, but because they weren't. We all fall short of the glory of God, but Jesus never once said, "Get a job you lazy bum." He did the opposite. He offered the love, the acceptance, and the forgiveness that only He could. All Christians are expected to do our best to live up to that example.

*All bold and italic emphasis mine

 

One of my favorite West Wing moments.

 

What do you think that he would have said if the masses he was so generous to responded with, "You didn't give us your fair share, you could have given us more, you have fish and loaves at our expense, you are greedy, etc."

.... and that does not seem to be a very Christian thing for the masses to do.

 

I'm not sure what you are asking.

My initial response is that He would say something like,

You are forgiven. Go forth in peace and in love for your fellow man. Love and care for one another as My Father has loved and cared for you.

But I'll await clarification.

I will say this. If you're trying to use Jesus' message to promote a fiscally conservative position (in the modern sense), that's a loser every time as I understand His teachings. Jesus was the ultimate liberal of his day. There's no getting around that.

 

I'll add that Jesus went after the money changers in the Temple pretty hard too.

 

Jesus was also known to get angry (money changers in the temple). I suspect that people not appreciating the blessings he gave, demanding more blessings from him, "You are greedy Jesus, give us more"; could be cause for anger.

 

I don't disagree with that.

I'll put a different spin on it though. He would be angry because people weren't using their blessings in the correct way, ie, using them to meet the needs of the less fortunate. He never taught amassing of earthly wealth.

He said it was easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than a rich man to enter the Kingdom of God.

Here's a difinitive answer on the matter:
Matthew 6:19-24

19 “Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moths and vermin destroy, and where thieves break in and steal.
20 But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moths and vermin do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal.
21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.
22 “The eye is the lamp of the body. If your eyes are healthy,your whole body will be full of light.
23 But if your eyes are unhealthy,your whole body will be full of darkness. If then the light within you is darkness, how great is that darkness!
24 “No one can serve two masters. Either you will hate the one and love the other, or you will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money.




Joel Osteen is a money grubbing hack.

 

Weren't the money changers making an obscene profit from the things necessary to receive a blessing by Hebrew teachings?

Folks will always get what they want to find from the Bible, but the feeding of the 5,000 seems more directly related. A kid who actually had a lunch was asked to give it all up to the masses, and he did. Now that a supernatural event was required to make that work out alright is a weakness for the real world... but only for an atheist. It seems the message for a believer is clear.

 

I fell comfortable in your explanations of how the person with wealth should share. I feel a lacking from you guys in an explanation of the recipient saying, [uck fay] you for your giving, you should give more, you are greedy, etc.

 

It sucks that some people are bitter, hurt, and/or hopeless. They weren't born that way. Hopefully they don't die that way.

 

Holy crap dude. I'm probably going to break 1500 hours of OT this year and didn't think it would be possible to do any more.

 

Ah. I understand now.

Indulge me a personal story please.

My father-in-law is one of the best men I know. He has been a leader in church his entire adult life, and full disclosure, we disagree vehemently on politics.

Churches, as those who attend know, often have people come seeking help of some kind, often financial. I 100% believe that we should be good stewards of, well, God's money. The decision on whether or not to meet each request or not can be agonizing. My f-i-l used to get twisted in knots over whether we were being conned or not. One day, we had this situation. Sure enough, he's torn up. Are we getting taken here? Is this legit? I looked over to him and basically said that we need to do everything we can to confirm that there is a need & make sure that any help we give will be used to meet that need. However, we will never be 100% sure. So, what should we do? Well, frankly, what would Jesus do in the situation? If we sought the answer to that based on His teachings and then acted upon that, there's no way we can lose. He looked at me like I had an elbow growing out of my forehead. I went on to say that as Christians, we are commanded to be as much like Jesus as possible, and Jesus helped people. Sure, it's not a great feeling to get taken, but in the end, we did the right thing in giving help because we aren't responsible for what others do. Even if they were lying, we followed Jesus' example and showed love and compassion. That's all He ever asked of His people. He said to go out and preach the gospel. Showing love and compassion is part of His gospel. He never said that everyone who we shared with would believe. That's not our job. It is the Holy Spirit that convicts man's heart. We did our job by sharing. What people do with that is between them and God. So, does it really matter if we were wrong about what we felt was a genuine need we helped meet? No. We followed Jesus' example, and if we did that, it's all good no matter what. We can lay down at night with a clean conscious knowing we gave more than lip service to our beliefs. We acted upon them. In the end, that's what we are required to do. The rest is up to God, and I have faith that He is overqualified to handle any situation like that. Stepping out on faith is what God wants. If Hee cares to know the number of hairs on our head, surely He cares enough to know the motives in our heart and take care of the situation. I looked at my f-i-l, told him that we need to do our part, then let go and let God handle the rest.

He still worries about getting taken, but for once, I think I was able to help him on a spiritual matter. Dude's pretty sharp.

 

Kmf is legit superhuman.

 

Hone up the old guillotine

 

Two hurricanes, one in south Florida, one in St. Croix. Plus my normal ridiculous schedule. I'm trying to cut back, a lot.

 

Thanks, but no.

 

I look up to a guy, Mike Holt, I take a lot of his classes and attend a lot of his lectures. He is definitely a man of God and he tells you all the time. He does a lot for the electrical industry, and a lot of what he does, he does for free. Jay, that verse puts it in perspective for me, and I do give, probably not as much as I can. I'm not going to list them to show what a good person I am, but the people and organizations that helped take care and raise me as a young person, I try to help them now. The thing is, I'm just tired of seeing the people that need so much help, paying for groceries at Walmart with the USA card, with golf chains, tattoos, expensive shoes. It's just abuse, and its frustrating. Anyone want to get more than a little irritated, go to a Miami-Dade Walmart and see what people drive that get assistance.

And by the way, I think its important to have differing views of the world, like Jay and IP, and even Uni. It keeps balance, but lately the world is getting out of balance and if we don't see things the same way, clearly the other person is insane.