School Voucher Study - "Results...the worst ever in field"

Studying the application of the voucher system in Indiana, researchers found abysmal results for students using the system. Amazing how, as teachers have mostly noted, merely shepherding kids into "superior" private schools doesn't improve the quality of education for everyone. It's a much different deal when you have to start accepting everyone rather than filtering in your student population.

Of great interest to me, regarding the abject attempt to vanquish the public education system, is this paragraph:

 

Sorry, article link is https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/02/23/upshot/dismal-results-from-vouchers-surprise-researchers-as-devos-era-begins.html?mc=aud_dev&mcid=fb-nytimes&mccr=MarchHighADLowMC&mcdt=2017-03&subid=MarchHighADLowMC&ad-keywords=AudDevGate&_r=0&referer=https://m.facebook.com/home.php

 

People should have the right to choose inferior educational results.

 

It's all a mess, but I don't think giving more power to the parents is a bad thing.

 

I agree instead of being forced into it

 

I worry the voucher system will lead to a lot of fraudulent schools and will be a disaster.

 

No way. Look at for profit prisons.

#welloiledmachine

 

There's absolutely no comparison in my area between public and Parochial schools, even in affluent areas. Zero chance in hell I'd send my kid to a public.

 

Why should I have to pay for some kid going to a private school, especially if it, clearly, isn't improving the educational experience of those students? Why should I pay for educational entities like for-profit charter schools which gut my neighborhood's public schools?

 

Bear with me because I'm honestly curious and don't claim to know much about these voucher programs. In some states do private schools always take the same standardized tests as public schools? I'm curious about the percentiles talked about above.

Edit: That was not intended as a response to your post at all. I'm just curious how it works and thought you'd be the best person to ask.

 

As has been said before, the real problem isn't with most public schools, it's the families that the failing kids are coming from.

 

Probably so. But I don't mean it sarcastically.

 

Pretty much.

 

How about a family voucher program, in which children can choose their parents? It has all the logic of fixing schools through vouchers.

 

same for me. on the other hand I bought in said area knowing that I'd have to send my kids to private school rather than paying far more to go to the better public schools area.

I like the idea of vouchers, but they'd be a [itch bay] to get right IMO. people like you and I guarantee you are just giving money to people who didn't need the vouchers in the first place and even if you have some sort of income threshold you have that problem.

 

The for-profit school scandals sure don't get enough attention.

 

I wish. I really do. I've seen some shithead parents

 

it's hard for me to get the theory that private schools could be worse than public on average, but I realize that I may be in an area different than the rest of the country. sure you have the self selection problem where the parents who give a shit are far more likely to send their kids to private school than those who don't give a shit, but isnt' that environment helpful for the bad students too? my wife has taught both and I don't think there is any question the quality of education is FAR better in this area in the private schools. as an example my niece went to public school and got straight As without trying and when they put her in private school she practically flunked out. I realize that this isn't the same everywhere htough.

 

Having attended High School 2 years in a Metro Nashville public school and 2 years in private High School, the private school was better all around. That being said, I was in the honors program at both. The public school honors classes were comparative to private in both education quality and student quality. However, when you had elective classes with the general student population, there was a stark contrast. Bottom line is, charter schools or public schools, you are trying to solve an unsolvable problem. Just like there will always by a certain % of people in poverty there will also always be a certain % of kids that will do very poorly in school. The sad part is, if you weren't in honors classes then you received a sub-standard education (in public, not private). So, as usual, the average students get screwed by pandering to the bottom 20%. Hopefully things have changed in the last 20 years, although from what I gather from friends it doesn't sound like it has.

 

If the argument here is that public schools are, by and large and in general, just as good or better than private schools - meaning that they consistently produce superior, or even equitable results - then I question the veracity of not only that claim, but any research which suggests it.

If the point is also, or instead, to assert that it is the possibility - even the un/likelihood, and however real or remote - it seems impossible to use this as the reason to limit, stifle or refuse the availability of not only school choice, but any choice at all, by anyone, for any reason.

I "get" that you are against school vouchers, just as you are equally certain that I am in favor of them - but you're attack on this choice is not only out of character for you, but doesn't align with the rest of what I have thought your aver-arching political beliefs to be. Perhaps I have completely misunderstood them. In fact, it's not only antithetical to your political bent, but will easily unravel many of your other deeply-held positions, however unwittingly, and which are likely much more fundamentally important to you, beyond this singular issue, alone. You can choose to limit and prohibit choice here, but you might want to think about other issues, where the application of that logic would then necessarily and also apply.

Some (admittedly) theatrical - but no less true - examples of applying this same sort of logic to other issues you feel strongly about:

It is universally accepted that a woman may experience genuinely injurious physical and mental harm as a result of having an abortion, both in the near and long-term, and which she would not otherwise experience were she not allowed to have chosen the abortion....do you agree that we should also remove that choice, as a result?

I may cast my vote for a candidate to office whom I feel will best represent my interests, but without having taken the time to learn of her/his views on any number of issues which are important to me, and who turns out to work against my interests, once elected....would you advocate that I be refused the choice of casting my vote?

I may choose to state a political opinion on my company's Twittter account, and it leads to a widespread backlash and a loss of clients....wouldn't the removal or reduction in my choice in exercising my freedom of speech be the best and most likely means of preventing my saying something which had the unintended consequence of causing me harm?

You would never agree to any of these - perhaps quite rightfully - but neither should you argue to do so here, on school choice.