I'm still wondering where society put me into the HOV lane of life, perhaps someone more familiar can tell me where my folks went wrong. My parents grew up as farmers, not dirt floor poor but poor enough for some to scoff at, and through whatever stroke of fate ended up having me. A privileged white kid. My dad was a fireman, mom a nurse at Yale, and Dad cut grass to allow myself and my sisters to play youth hockey. [uck fay]ing privileged, I am. Because Dad worked 90 hours a week all told so his kids could play a game he loved, and would teach them about life. But that has nothing to do with hard work and determination, that's privilege. My brother in law grew up in a single family home, but set his sights on being a CT State Trooper, and due to his being privileged he was able to gain that title and the benefits that go with it. There's no way his hard work and follow through would have paid off if he were a minority, other than the fact that he's black. I can tolerate being lectured by a garden variety communist like Uni, he means no harm and has a sense of candor, but not a straight piece of shit like Dooz.
I think you have a misunderstanding of the way privileged is used here, though. It doesn't mean the sort of silver spooned person who has an easy life by being born on third base. It doesn't even mean you are "given" much of anything. It does mean there are certain ingrained advantages one has by being a straight white male, which doesn't preclude one from living in poverty or a person of color from having success. It certainly doesn't mean white men don't have to struggle to succeed. However, there are less obstacles thrown in the way and there are more structures of support which have been established over the course of many years which assist straight white men in these pursuits. I think the biggest problem has been straight white men feel they are at fault, individually, for the existence of this "privilege" and react defensively to a perceived accusation. In reality, it's more about systematic advantages. But, it, again, isn't about every straight white dude having a golden paved pathway to wealth and easy living. Also, I'm not a communist.
Aww, pumpkin, I get it. You’ve heard some things that you don’t like, and while they’re true, it’s made you want to lash out. It’s ok. I can take it.
Yeah, typically the idea of privilege is often taken to the extreme of silver spoon / if you’re white and male you don’t have to work hard to succeed. On an individual basis, it can quickly be rejected as a stupid notion by many when using this as the definition. But I usually think of privilege as the set of influences that might impede another due to their sex or color that I didn’t face, even if the other person grew up in the same house, community, etc. that I did. I do accept that white privilege exists but I don’t feel guilty about it. I can’t stop it. But by trying to be aware of it, I’ve been helped in some situations. If I wanted to look at privilege as the silver spoon view it’d be easy enough to reject. Like many here, I grew up in a rural setting where things were tight. Both of my parents did graduate high school, but they went straight to work after without any additional training or school. We had our needs met growing up and even had extra at times of my parents planned for it - but I also know that if they hadn’t had family to rely on for things like babysitting, tended a massive garden each year, canned for the winter, filled our freezer with game, self-fixed everything at home, and worked their asses off and at times stuck with shitty situations at work because to move jobs and reset pay by 3-5 $/hr would have been a huge hit to the family’s income. My wife still complains that I don’t ever ‘know’ what I want for Christmas or birthdays. The truth is I have a complex that I’ve given myself. Years later and when my family’s budget has more room in it, my mind is still wired like it was when I was a kid - where I was too worried about my parents not being able to afford what I actually wanted to not only ask them for it but to even let myself really want it because I didn’t want to upset them or myself around those specia occasions. And I’m sure I’m not the only one here who could tell that story. Yet, I also believe white privilege exists and that I do benefit from it. It can start in the womb. There are studies that indicate that women in general but black women specifically are more ignored when informing their medical treatment (for example, when describing pain). It seems to be a white male privilege that you are the most ‘heard’ (on average if these studies are correct) by our doctors. Or, from my cousin who as I’ve mentioned before has adopted to black boys - It extends to when you are five and sitting in the back seat and you roll up to a stop sign beside a truck waving the confederate flag and you start shifting your weight nervously as you ask your mom how you know if the guy flying that is the good kind of guy that doesn’t mean bad or the bad kind that might actually want to hurt them and you don’t feel safe driving down the road or know if you’re accepted by your community. Or when you’re ten and your mom sends you into the convenience store to get some things and you’re followed around the store and then asked where you got the money. You begin to not question if you’re not accepted by your community but ask why you’re not. This even extends to adults who can’t walk through their own neighborhoods without a neighbor reporting a suspicious person or the cops pulling over tonask where you’re heading. Or not being able to talk the way you would normally talk at work because you don’t feel it would be accepted (some Southerners struggle with this outside the South too). One way that these sorts of things that most white people dont encounter can add up to actually affect success in life is through the lack of feeling included. If these things happen enough, it gets ingrained. Or, you generally feel more accepted around your black community, which you aren’t necessarily around in your workplace. There have been plenty of studies that show if you don’t feel accepted in school, work, etc. that your best ideas don’t come out. You don’t express yourself like other or grow like others. This is why diversity and inclusion programs in workplaces aren’t just SJW-hat-tipping. It’s an aim to extract the most value you can out of your workforce and lack of inclusion prevents that. I don’t feel like I need to apologize to anyone for being a white male. I also don’t feel like anyone is really asking me to apologize for any success I’ve found in life, since I’m a white male. I feel that any success I’ve found is my own accomplishment. But, I also recognize that every path is different and I had the privilege not to have to deal with some obstacles that others have faced - and some of those obstacles appear due to things like sex or race. And I want to work where I can to lessen those o stacked for others - and to try to be damned sure that I’m not the one presenting those obstacles (concious or unconscious bias, for example). ——————- Side story on an already long lost. I work with a black guy who I was discussing raising kids with. I was talking about how my wife and I were trying different forms of disclipine and how my wife and I don’t always agree. He was telling me how strict he and his wife were. He asked if I knew why? I asked him if his dad was in the military. That wasn’t it, though. The reason was because he said your kids might be able to get away with not always showing respect in life but if I don’t teach my kids to have ultimate respect for all authority, there’s a good chance they’ll end up face down in the street dead. I don’t know HOW true that is, but it was sobering that it was true enough to him that it guided his parenting.
So, you want us to accept your anecdotal evidence, as a white person, but not ones from "random minorities who have no idea what they are talking about"? Could it be you've inadvertently given an example of the thing you don't believe exists?
There are some white folks out there who are struggling just as bad and have just as much of a deck stacked against them than any minority. I see them every damn day and you do as well.
Is this the part where I tell you the feeling is mutual or that I don’t give the first shit what you think about me?
Again, it doesn't mean people don't have personal struggles to overcome if they are white or anything of this sort. It does mean, structurally, it must definitely is easier to be a straight white male. Look at the power structures in government, business, everywhere. It's disproportionately represented by white males. Look at incarceration rates, disparities in wealth, punishment for similar offenses, hell even measures like health considerations. And, even those poor whites can get plugged into a faster pathway of success, or ones with less obstacles, than a person of color in a similar situation. It's just the reality of how our society is. It certainly is getting better, but the advantages of being a straight white male are certainly still distinct. And, I come from rural poverty like most here, too. I think it comes across to white men who object as if it invalidates their hard work or ignores the struggles of white men to be successful, but everyone has struggles, obstacles, but society still makes it, in general, for people like me to find success.
I'm not sure I should even mention straight anymore. Surely, no one can argue being gay isn't more difficult than being straight, right?
Every gay person i know is financially good and happy, except for my brother. Edit, just drove by this house. Among the truly priveleged white men at the Gov Club, the owners of this house and the setting [uck fay] up all assumptions. A gay couple live here. Quite a big and plump blond fella and an Asian man who dresses like pee wee Herman and always smiling. They are multimillionairre jewelers and friends with everyone up there. Ive not heard a word on the course said about them except they only deal in diamonds of 2 million and more. Just a random share. Things are never as they seem. Nobody cares. Ftr I'm a social member. There are some loaded dudes up there. I'm not one of them. Didnt mean to imply that
Again, it's not if they found success, it's if their pathway to that success is more difficult because of who they are. You can't seriously argue it isn't. Not unless I'm missing the straight people who are disowned by their families, harassed/beaten, actively have governments trying to take away their marriage amd adoption rights, associated with pedophilia and a host of all kinds of issues because of their sexual orientation. Are people committing suicide because they can't handle the rejection of being straight? Are there homeless kids because families kicked then out for being straight? Are there organizations devoted to"cutting" people from being straight? The number for all the above for straight people is zero, likely. It should be inarguable. Being straight is "normal" and unquestioned, being gay has all kinds of challenges.
Yeah i agree but seems to me the gay people that are officially out tend to be happy and successful around here. They arent treated equally by everyone though and thats obvious. Its just not always the homophobic racist old white man with the issues.
I just read the part about suicide. Id be careful there. Ive seen it happen too many of my military and "normal" dad acquaintances or their wife who couldnt have kids and hung herself from the chandelier. Pressure is pressure.
100%. Ive thrown away food from a fast food window in amazement that the manager put the 2 tooth lady at the window
Generally, yes, but that's a different argument. This still doesn't counter the argument it is easier to be a straight white male in this society. It is.
