Paris terror attack kills 12

I have a problem with Mother Teresa. The rest not as much, I just don't give credit to religion because of a few extraordinary people who happened to subscribe to one religion or another, and then not factor in the many bad people who did as well. Either affiliation gives you credit/demerit, or affiliation doesn't. Either way, it doesn't look good for religion.

 

There's a joke about fire here, but I'll refrain because I don't want it to be taken the wrong was resulting in me being lumped into the bad fruit barrel.

 

I love you too.

 

But yet we all come back here and post.

 

The human condition. The ego wants us to be right and everyone to know we are right. Or we just like to argue.

 

I think its the fruit in general. Im not sure we agree on what "bad" exactly is.

 

I disagree.

I mean agree.

 

I disagree with gcb (and tenny) that these are futile exchanges. They don't change my opinion, but they certainly shift my perspective and understand the points of contention better. I enjoy them.

 

I do care about each of you.

I just don't understand what either side is thinking, in these debates.

In a real sense, you each want to eradicate the other side - and that will never happen, nor should it.

So just leave them to it.

I don't see the harm in that.

If you fear that your God can be toppled or disproven by the likes of IP and Hat - or billions more, and far smarter and more astute than anything that they alone could produce - then the problem is not "god", but you. You need a new and real God.

If you fear that some mythical god will intrude upon and compel you into belief, then trust reason and intellect to ultimately win the day - just as it has always done. If you believe that no god exists, then stop giving it the credence of forming reasonable arguments against it - because, by definition, it cannot be reasonable, at all.

Neither side will vanquish or convert the other side.

Ever.

EVER.

So learn to live with the disagreement, instead, and stop arguing about that which none of you can either prove or support, under any circumstances.

It's the height of futility and lunacy.

 

As do I. If I didn't, Id find something else to do.

Sometimes you just get the impression that what you are and what you believe are misunderstood. While clearing that up may not change the first mind either way, it at least lets everyone know where you are. It may not be exactly where you think compared to the next guy.

 

I agree. I'm not trting to convince anyone of anything. The way we live ours lives speaks for us all.

 

I'm honestly not trying to change anyone's mind, nor do I feel that it's my duty to do so. That is what the Holy Spirit does. Like gbc said, it's impossible to convey something so personal.

My main point of, for lack of a better term, contention is the generalizations. There are good and bad in all things. I just hope that I'm not living in a way that I could give folks evidence that faith is bad.

 

True as well.

 

Bullshit.

You (and Hat) are arrogant *******s, who think you're the smartest guys in the room, have come to the conclusion that there is no God, and find it to be personally insulting that any reasonable person could arrive at any other possible conclusion.

These religious discussions do nothing but provide a medium by which the atheists spew their own acerbic brand of blindness and ignorance at those whom you, ironically enough, claim to be the ignorantly blind amongst us.

You don't believe that God exists, and you'd hate him if he did. And worst, you hate him most of all because he doesn't exist, and has no intention of "proving" his existence to you, even if he did.

You learn nothing from these debates, and you teach even less.

 

Do you want me to tally up the number of posts you've made in "not trying to convert anyone", versus the number that the Holy Spirit has been trusted to make, instead?

 

I know I have here and in everyday life at times.
We have done a poor job (generally) at times of messing up something pure and perfect.

 

Uh, this hasn't been what I or Hat or anyone has been saying or fearing at all. Not even close. There is no resemblance to what I think or believe in what you just typed. I think humans naturally gravitate towards belief and faith to make sense of a complicated and unknowable universe. Reason and intellect are most obviously not guaranteed to win the day, and that isn't rooted in fear of some god.

 

There's a time to think and a time to act - and on the question of religion, it's never a good time to think.

Don't start getting all self-reflective now.

Full steam ahead, I say.

 

That's not necessary. But I have shared what my faith means to me and why I believe what I do. If that isn't the message I've given off, I apologize to all. I never intended to be preachy. I don't like being preached at myself.

I'm not the greatest at relaying my points. My wife tends to agree with that statement too, so I'm not surprised at any confusion.

 

Boo!

Less thinking, more shouting! Wild denouncements for all!