The NBA Thread.

Pointing out one guy's significant playoff success and another's complete lack there of is not a "Kobe>LeBron because rings" argument. Are you high? The reason that Kobe/LeBron argument is dumb is because Kobe has 5 rings and LeBron has 4. The more apt comparison would be "Kobe>Harden because rings," which is absolutely true because 5 rings is light years better than 1 finals appearance.

Let Shai do it in the playoffs before we start putting him ahead of guys who have already done it and are still playing at an all-NBA level. AD is 24-12-4 on 55% from the field and might be the best defender in the entire NBA. It's not like he's fallen off or something. And he's shown he can dominate in the playoffs, even if he was LeBron's #2. He was 23-14-3 with 4.5 stocks per game in a conference finals run JUST LAST SEASON for [uck fay] sake. And in his Finals run as a #2, he was 28-10-4 with a number of pivotal moments.

Shai's next game in the god damn second round will be his 1st. Pump the damn breaks.

The Jokic thing isn't all that hard to follow, man. Traditionally, the MVP comes from a 1 or 2 seed. Like, let's pull up the list and post the percentage of how often the guy comes from a 1 or 2 seed.

Jokic won his first as a 3 seed. An outlier, sure, but not super egregious. But the problem is his stats were better the following season, so he locked in a back-to-back (a unique honor few have achieved), even though his team was the damn 6 seed and he hadn't done anything in the playoffs yet (outside of a fluky conference finals run in the bubble). And don't tell me it's "a regular season award." Guys who win back-to-back MVP's should be good enough to carry their teams, to some degree. Jokic got gentleman's swept in the first round one of those seasons and got actually swept in the 2nd round by the pre-Durant Suns the other. It wasn't a good look.

So then, by the time he got the 1 seed the following year, they basically couldn't give it to him because letting him 3-peat would be ridiculous. And that was probably the season he MOST deserved it out of the 3. And he went on and dominated the playoffs that same season.

Donovan Mitchell and James Harden were not in my top 10. Your memory is failing you. In that discussion, too, the question was what sort of top 10 we were discussing - a top 10 players in the NBA in general list, or a top 10 players in the NBA for that season.

This was my list (April 24th, 2022):

If I remember correctly:

• Dame had been 1st or 2nd team all-NBA the 4 previous seasons.
• AD had a title and dominant playoff run a year and a half prior.
• The Celtics were the 7 seed, a .500 team, and gentleman's swept out in the first round the year before.
• No one had Tatum as a top 10 player going into the season, and all that had happened since then was a full regular season.
• You seemed to think a good regular season was enough to move him ahead of those guys (both of whom were dealing with injuries). I didn't. Once he made the finals run, I was more open to it. But that hadn't happened yet.

And even then, you snuck him in at 9th. Imagine ranking a guy 9th and then yelling at people who, in a largely subjective discussion, think there are 2 other guys who could be ranked ahead of him.

 

Wob's tweet game is always strong, but this one in particular made me laugh out loud:

https://x.com/WorldWideWob/status/1769925609088794950?s=20

 

Also, good to see Paul Pierce is still bitter.

 

"Your memory is failing you"

 

Lot of words to not even try to refute the fact that Shai is playing at a higher level than AD ever has, prior to reaching his prime. Jamal Murray has done it in the playoffs blah blah blah, I dare you to say he's better than Shai lol

(This is insane lol, that's further than Embiid has ever been and his team had a very similar record to Jokic)

This is pure narrative BS

So is this lol, nothing about the best player winning MVP is "ridiculous." You are just neck deep in weird narratives talking about how it's "not that complicated"

So the guy who "wasn't good enough to carry his team" carried it to a championship, but contrary to common sense, that doesn't make you wrong as hell. It isn't even all that hard to follow, man.

 

We are talking top 10. Neither of those guys was in my top 10. So I’m not sure how they really fit in this conversation.

But while we are here, Mitchell was coming off 2 playoff runs where he averaged 36 points and 32 points, respectively. Arguing that he was better than Tatum was perfectly reasonable. Even this season he was on the path to 1st or 2nd team all NBA after being 2nd team last year.

AD finished 3rd in MVP voting and DPOY voting in 2018. Shai might finish second in MVP this year, only because Embiid got hurt. Where’s he gonna finish in DPOY voting?

Nuggets were down 3-1 in the first AND second rounds before being slaughtered by LeBron and AD in the conference finals. And you could make an argument that Jokic was the #2 on that run. At BEST he was 1a or 1b. Murray was ridiculous during that run. And again, Embiid missed the conference finals on a fluke buzzer beater as the clear #1.

It’s not though. Look at the list of guys with back to back MVP’s. And you’re telling me Jokic was that level of all-time great but couldn’t take one game off of a Suns team led by Devin Booker, an aging Chris Paul, and Deandre Ayton? Come on.

3 guys have 3-peated. Bird, Russell, Wilt. Putting Jokic in a list with those guys just couldn’t happen before he won a title. Would have been a disaster. Which is why he shouldn’t have gotten one of the first two.

The man didn’t carry his team. Give me a break. Jamal Murray went [uck fay]ing nuts in the playoffs, and he’s surrounded by excellent role players who fit his playstyle perfectly. He’s their best player, by a fair margin, of course, but to say he “carried” them is just nonsense. There’s a reason he went from getting swept in the second round and gentlemen’s swept in the first round to winning the whole damn thing once he got his teammates back from injury.

 

Can we circle back on the Luka/Shai comparison?

Lol

 

It's one game, but Shai going 12-3-2 against the Bucks while Giannis went 30-19-4 feels like it leans in the direction of proving my point about listing Shai at number 4 right now.

 

Wow, what a game.

 

The number of lucky rebounds the Bucks have gotten in the last 2 minutes has been astounding. Ball just clanging right at people.

 

[uck fay]ing joke to lose this game to this team after being up 19 in the 4th quarter. [uck fay]ing joke. There's just something missing with this Bucks team.

 

Victim of the NBA fix. Gotta make sure LeBron and the Lakers make the playoffs.

 

It was a deft plan. Especially the part where they decided to keep giving the ball to the Bucks third option in Middleton over and over late in the fourth. I also continue to be very underwhelmed by Dame as a "superstar". I'd rather have Allen and Jrue back. My soul still hurts from losing Holiday.

 

The Phoenix Suns are on the edge of catastrophe. The dropped a game to the Spurs last night, and Wemby didn't even play. They are the 8 seed, 2 games ahead of the 9th seed Lakers (who have the tie-breaker over them), and their schedule down the stretch is absolutely brutal. Every single game left is against a playoff team:

@Denver (West 1 Seed)
@OKC (West 2 Seed)
@New Orleans (West 5 Seed)
Vs Cleveland (East 3 Seed
Vs Minnesota (West 3 Seed)
Vs New Orleans (West 5 Seed)
Vs Clippers (West 4 Seed)
@Clippers (West 4 Seed)
@Sacramento (West 6 Seed)
@Minnesota (West 3 Seed)

Their one saving grace may be the fact that the Clippers seems completely lost right now, and the Wolves are missing KAT (not sure when he's expected back). The Suns are all in with Booker, Durant, and Beal. To be at high risk of the play-in, with the chance of missing the playoffs altogether very much on the table, is Armageddon for this team.

 

“My guy” Nick Wright had a great point today.
The Lakers’ best shot at the Nuggets may actually be to get them in round one. More days between games lets them play Bron and AD bigger minutes with more rest between games. Also protects them from playing Denver coming out of a 6-7 game series when Denver finished theirs in 4-5.

Doesn’t mean they’d be likely to win or anything. But if the thought is they’re going to have to go through a healthy Denver team at some point, round one is probably their best shot.

 

In the most likely scenario, the Lakers don't even get to round one.

 

I’m not sure that’s the most likely scenario anymore, and even if it is, it probably won’t be for long.

3 of the Lakers next 4 games are against Toronto, the Nets, and the Wizards.

Meanwhile, the Suns are playing the Nuggets right now and then have OKC, New Orleans, Cleveland, and Minnesota.

Hell, even the 7 seed is within striking distance.

 

Found Indy's TikTok

https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZPRTmgNft/

 

All jokes aside, that dude kind of reminds me of James, from Love on the Spectrum:



But LeBron deserves a song like that after going 9/10 from 3 last night. Dude's [uck fay]ing absurd.

 

Seems pretty valuable.

There are a number of teams who, since losing a key player, have played very well recently. The Wolves are 8-4 without KAT (and one of those losses was in OT). The Rockets are 9-1 over their last 10 without Sengun (admittedly against a weak-ish schedule). The Pelicans are 3-3 since Ingram went down, with the losses being to the Bucks, Suns, and Celtics.