Trump is in

i see. So being a friendly neighbor is solely a one way street?

 

Demanding your neighbor build a fence for you isn't friendly.

 

Is that silent snaps and coos I hear coming from the left apologists?

 

Just eye rolling. The narrative is always about how naive and stupid "the commoners" are when a democrat is elected President.

 

Nor is sending your poorest people and your criminals onto their soil.

 

Serious Clark? You are seriously arguing republicans pull the intellectual card everytime they lose? What percentage of the republican candidates have been called idiots by the left in the past 40 years?

 

This sounds exactly like the diatribe that Bill the Butcher issued when talking about the Irish.

 

And can we just establish that Mexico isn't sending anyone?

Mexicans are leaving a war-torn country (thanks to our inordinately stupid War on Drugs) to provide better opportunities for themselves and their children. That's the same way you got here, Droski. And don't forget that there were plenty of people here that would have despised your ancestors unless they were all:

White, Protestant, from either Germany/England/Scotland, already wealthy and educated.

 

Leaving the borders completely open is absolutely the same as sending people. Hell this is the same govt that distributed pamphlets about how to safely cross the border and live here undetected.

We are seriously comparing legal immigration with illegal immigration?

 

Why don't we go ahead and mention hitler and get this over with.

 

Agreed; it is much more friendly to leave the border floodgates open.

 

I was arguing their mentality is no different from the mentality of the people who immigrated to bring you here when you issued your "they're sending their poorest and criminal-element here". That was a very similar rhetoric used to villify and dehumanize Catholic and non-WASPy type European immigrants.

Just sounded similar to me is all.

And, when the Mexicans are having a hard enough time fighting the cartels, why would they spend time and money to stop people leaving Mexico?

 

IP is not going to support a Wall that restricts access to his fellow Democrat voters.

 

Doesn't that argue that said rhetoric is innacurate? Because it's an absolute fact that people who cross the border are FAR more likely than the average Mexican citizen to have a criminal record and far poorer than the average Mexican citizen.

They are actively encouraging illegal immigration. Hell illegal immigration and the money sent back is one of the backbones of their economy.

 

Trump Surges in Popularity in N.H.

http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2015/...y-in-n-h-taking-second-place-in-suffolk-poll/

 

Do you have any academic or at least renowned media sources for this? They're poor, sure. They're uneducated, probably. They might fall into a criminal lifestyle here, maybe.

But that's much the same as the talking points as the poor and uneducated Irish and Italians that were coming here and growing up in poverty and effectively had the same choice where they joined a gang more so as protection that evolved into a full-scale criminal organization.

Those Irish and Italian were usually the lowest class in their homeland and were completely different from the educated immigrant group of the Germans who were fleeing political unrest in Germany from the 1840s through the early 1900s.

I'm just looking at this with a sense of context. People were nay-saying back then with "The Pope is sending over these rats to erode our Protestant values" or "They have non-Anglican names, don't speak English and just don't fit in with Anglo values". They're very much the same talking points. Looks like the Irish and Italians amalgamated well, just over the course of several generations.

 

I get wanting to distinguish the nefarious immigrants from the rest but the ones who came here that hold dear the American Dream cannot be cast aside.

 

depending on the source it's estimated that 17-30% of illegal immigrants arrested for crossing the border had either criminal records here or on mexico. certainly much higher than the average population. we also know that 25% of inmates in California jails are Mexican nationals.

ok. and? we let them immigrate for a reason. mostly that we needed the labor.

so we should wait a couple of generations for them to acclimate? at what cost?

 

I want to distinguish between legal immigrants coming here on legal visas who were desperately needed as labor compared to illegal immigrants coming here illegally for a labor pool that is severely oversupplied. your comparison to immigration from 100 years ago just doesn't make sense for today. hell 30 years ago we probably needed the level of illegal immigrants for the workforce that we got. now we are unquestionably MILLIONS over that number and it's not stopping.

 

I wasn't creating a direct parallel between the two as obviously a good deal is different between now and 150 years ago. I just consider it intellectually dishonest if I know part of my ancestry were dirt poor Irish Catholic immigrants who where reviled using almost the same rhetoric that is being used against Mexican immigrants.

However, I also acknowledge there was a process of immigration and all immigrants came in via ships and to select ports of call. Irish and Italians weren't streaming in without any process of control.

It's a complicated situation to be sure and one we must be wary of being too reactionary over. That's all I'm calling for.